32: Godless

[myq]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

insisting all of everyone's--no, not everyone: women's--lower echelon cell bundles be brought to fruition isn't a victory. it's oppression.

This!

Especially if ceasing production of a few tiny cells can allow someone's resources to provide much more positive treatment of fully grown human beings that already exist around the world.

There are real live children suffering and dying every day. Let's help the people who are here first before insisting that every single cell that "CAN" become a person "MUST" become a person.

Preaching to mostly the choir, I know. But some people are singing a different tune. Listen to our song!

[Sparrow]

thankful for and inspired by the harmonies.

[DJQuad]

Originally Posted by myq

You have to "kill life" to survive. Plants are alive. So even if you're vegan, you must kill life to to live. You would be dead if you weren't killing life regularly.

You cant really compare killing a human fetus to killing a carrot in order to survive. Or maybe you can in that they're both life. Fuck if I know.. lol

You're right though (as are Sparrow and Scumhook's responses). It just fascinates me where people's lines are and their rationales - most of all the contradictions and then the understanding of those rationals, if that makes sense.

It's sort of like when people detest how cows are treated, yet there's a steak on their grill as they speak. The rationale is that it's food and we need it to survive, after that "oh shit I never thought of it that way, hmmm" moment. heh

[myq]

Originally Posted by DJQuad

You cant really compare killing a human fetus to killing a carrot in order to survive. Or maybe you can in that they're both life. Fuck if I know.. lol

It's sort of like when people detest how cows are treated, yet there's a steak on their grill as they speak. The rationale is that it's food and we need it to survive.

Right, but it doesn't need to be tortured to survive. You didn't answer my question though, are you a vegetarian?

Because you're right, comparing the death of a plant to that of an animal might be like comparing animals to oranges, but humans are animals, so comparing the treatment of a human fetus which is minimally different in biological structure from other mammalian fetuses up to a certain point, IS comparing animals to animals.

Life ends, for sure. Everything that lives, dies. But the question of when and how and how much it experiences pleasure or pain when it's alive, that isn't absolute. A small quantity of cells that contain human DNA don't suffer. Fully formed non-human animals do.

Look! You tried to make the conversation about abortion and I made it about veganism!

[Scumhook]

Originally Posted by DJQuad

You're right though (as are Sparrow and Scumhook's responses). It just fascinates me where people's lines are and their rationales - most of all the contradictions and then the understanding of those rationals, if that makes sense.

Of course I'm right.

If in doubt, follow my teachings.

I have no contradictions - everyone should be able to do whatever they want to their bodies. Including whatever they want to anything inside their bodies.

Life is complicated. I simplify it by not thinking too hard, by enjoying sunsets and puppies, and by having simple guiding principles.

[DJQuad]

Originally Posted by myq

Right, but it doesn't need to be tortured to survive. You didn't answer my question though, are you a vegetarian?

Oh I didn't respond to that part. I'm definitely not a vegetarian. I could try to defend that by reasons that are totally hypocritical like I only eat organic meat, I only eat meat 1-2 times a week, humans have survived by eating meat, whatever. At the end of the day (fuck I hate that expression), despite any reason it's still hypocritical as hell for the very reasons you explained.

Look! You tried to make the conversation about abortion and I made it about veganism!

lol. I'm sure you've answered this on the show, but why are you a vegan?

[DJQuad]

Originally Posted by Scumhook

I have no contradictions - everyone should be able to do whatever they want to their bodies. Including whatever they want to anything inside their bodies.

Life is complicated. I simplify it by not thinking too hard, by enjoying sunsets and puppies, and by having simple guiding principles.

It helps when you have no morals whatsoever.

LOL There's no middle-ground, we either compliment or insult each other. Cracks me up.

[Scumhook]

Originally Posted by DJQuad

It helps when you have no morals whatsoever.

IKR??? Like I said - keep it simple.

Originally Posted by DJQuad

LOL There's no middle-ground, we either compliment or insult each other. Cracks me up.

me too!!

[myq]

Originally Posted by DJQuad

I'm sure you've answered this on the show, but why are you a vegan?

Because the meat and dairy industries are inextricably linked. The factory farms that unnecessarily torture cows in the meat-making process are the same farms where most of the dairy comes from as well. You don't get dairy without pregnant cows, and often baby cows are turned to veal, some of the most horrendous treatment there is, and otherwise the mistreatment of most dairy cows is something that I don't want to participate in.

There are certainly farms and farmers and places where animals are NOT mistreated, and I entirely endorse the idea of getting your meat and dairy from those places (and I also know that class-wise, having the time to even think about all this stuff, let alone act on it, is easier the more money and time one has, but right now, we certainly all seem to have at least the time to discuss it), but for me personally, it's easier to just keep it away entirely. (There are no specific legal guidelines for "organic" or "free range" or things like that. Sometimes it just means there's a window in their immobilization chamber.)

So, that's why, for the most part. Thanks for asking!

[Sparrow]

we have this wonderful dairy farm here in northeast GA. check it: