1321: Crazy Bitch

[m0nty]

Originally Posted by Jo_Culprit

Slampokes is a lovely girl and despite my fondness for Erik Skov and his work Im going to have to side with her on this one.

Erik should've treated this like a detective case he needed to solve "I know you were logged in, I caught you ha! why didnt you reply?".

Erik's messages started out with expectation, then went self righteous far too quickly. Maybe doctorsleep has made me overlycritical of male virgins and see them all as spikey entitled weirdos but none of Slampokes's responses crossed me as out of line considering the tone and righteousness she was responding to.

Generally Im the type of guy that will be first to throw out terms like 'bitch' and 'cunt' if I think a woman is being a massively entitled douche but I dont think Slampokes is in the wrong here. Erik's game wasn't on the mark and I really think they could've gotten together if he had've been smoother and more intune.

No offense Erik, I don't think you're a bad dude but I think in a few years you'll have game enough to understand how you should've proceeded and worded your messages.

There should have been no "game" required of Erik. slampokes had said she would fuck him, end of story. She didn't say she'd go on a date, there were no caveats, he didn't have to live up to any expectation. The responsibility was all on slampokes' side.

In reality, slampokes never had any intention of fucking Erik, as she never thought through her initial rash statement. What she should have done was to have the courage to contact Erik, and apologise that her promise was made when she was drunk or high or otherwise irrational. To make up for disappointing him, she should have done something nice for him instead like send a raunchy photo so he wouldn't feel terrible about himself. As it is, she has toyed with a vulnerable young man's sexual confidence.

Rejection by a beautiful woman is a hard thing for a young man to take. In this case, Erik wasn't even pursuing her, but slampokes inserted herself into his life and rejected him anyway. This is on her, all the way.

[Blitzgal]

This one is pretty simple. People get to change their mind. And everyone does it. Nonresponse is a standard way of trying to get the point across without hurting the other person, and both men and women do it. We even have code terms for it -- a vague "I'll call you" actually means "We're done here." When you keep pushing after you've gotten the hint that nothing is going to happen, then the other person gets irritated. Again, this is something that both men and women do. Shit, I remember at 18 one time calling a guy at work because he hadn't called me. He was creeped out because I hadn't followed the standard social rule that you're supposed to take the hint and move on already.

When you've just started dating someone they don't owe you anything, so they definitely don't owe you shit if you haven't even met them yet. Everyone learns this eventually, it just stings the first few times. But you buck up and move on. Welcome to the world of dating.

[ThePinkSuperhero]

Originally Posted by Jo_Culprit

Erik's messages started out with expectation, then went self righteous far too quickly.

I totally agree. Not that slampokes wasn't wrong to joke about sleeping with him in the first place, but come on, dude, this is some random attention-seeking girl on an internet forum, did you REALLY think she was going to sleep with you? Your 1st message was polite but there was a whiff of desperation, and it was all downhill from there. As others have said, non-response is a response. Is that fair? Maybe not, but that's the way of the world. You have to learn how to deal with it in a mature manner, because throwing a tantrum like you did over this is SO not sexy.

[Carruthers]

Originally Posted by m0nty

There should have been no "game" required of Erik. slampokes had said she would fuck him, end of story. She didn't say she'd go on a date, there were no caveats, he didn't have to live up to any expectation. The responsibility was all on slampokes' side.

Not in the old-fashioned world of ladies and gentleman, old chap. A lady is always allowed to change her mind, and she doesn't have to justify that change of mind. And a gentleman shouldn't challenge it.

But, lest we think we're not living in that kind of world any more and it's just too impossibly unfeminist (we're all equal and should have equal expectations of eachother's manners) there is still a biological basis at the bottom of that old-fashioned convention, and it is that - resourcewise - it's fucking expensive for a female to have a baby but it costs a male nothing. I speak purely biologically you understand.

Originally Posted by m0nty

In reality, slampokes never had any intention of fucking Erik, as she never thought through her initial rash statement. What she should have done was to have the courage to contact Erik, and apologise that her promise was made when she was drunk or high or otherwise irrational. To make up for disappointing him, she should have done something nice for him instead like send a raunchy photo so he wouldn't feel terrible about himself. As it is, she has toyed with a vulnerable young man's sexual confidence.

By the same token I don't think that any of that really matters. This abstraction of a lady I'm talking about is never required to justify such a thing.

Originally Posted by m0nty

Rejection by a beautiful woman is a hard thing for a young man to take. In this case, Erik wasn't even pursuing her, but slampokes inserted herself into his life and rejected him anyway. This is on her, all the way.

But, as I said earlier, I'm still on Erik's side, despite all the above, because he did not deserve the treatment he got. He's the victim of an over-reaction, an over-reaction which - due to its seriousness (it's quite a big deal for a male to be threatened with sex-offender-registration) - left him little choice but to go public with it. There's no question of liking or disliking the actors in this minor tragedy. One may quite easily continue to like them both, to the extent that one knows eithr of them (I do not) and think nothing but well of them. Things just got out of hand and I doubt it would have happened at all had they had a real conversation at some KATG event.

[Junkenstein]

seriously how in the name of god does dropping a sentence like "id fuck you" become an obbligation?

there's been a bunch of ladies that dropped stuff like that, especially in places like internet communities. but that doesnt mean they'll HAVE to do it. what the fuck is this, craigslist?

so if a girl dares to say no to a guy that did two shorts for the show she HAS to sleep with him and treat him with gloves?

Its fucking retarded. dont be surpirsed when cases like Jeremy pop up.

[lattaland]

If there is a lesson to be had here, it's this: If a woman says she wants to fuck you, she probably really doesn't.

[m0nty]

Originally Posted by Carruthers

Not in the old-fashioned world of ladies and gentleman, old chap. A lady is always allowed to change her mind, and she doesn't have to justify that change of mind. And a gentleman shouldn't challenge it.

But, lest we think we're not living in that kind of world any more and it's just too impossibly unfeminist (we're all equal and should have equal expectations of eachother's manners) there is still a biological basis at the bottom of that old-fashioned convention, and it is that - resourcewise - it's fucking expensive for a female to have a baby but it costs a male nothing. I speak purely biologically you understand.

That is a bunch of horse hooey. This is not jolly old Victorian England (mind you, that was never all that genteel either). There have to be some sort of rules, some consistency, in the relations between men and women. Yes, a woman is always allowed to change her mind, and no she doesn't have to justify it, but the man shouldn't have to guess. Communication is the key here.

More importantly, slampokes' real mistake here was not only to not communicate that she had changed her mind, but then to try to turn it around to make Erik think it was his fault that she didn't want to fuck him. That is an egregious bending of the Marquess of Queensberry rules you seem to think should regulate such interactions. She didn't owe him anything, but she also didn't have the right to attack him like she did.

[m0nty]

Originally Posted by lattaland

If there is a lesson to be had here, it's this: If a woman says she wants to fuck you, she probably really doesn't.

That sort of cynicism also leads to men thinking no doesn't mean no. Dangerous territory.

[Blitzgal]

Originally Posted by Junkenstein

seriously how in the name of god does dropping a sentence like "id fuck you" become an obbligation?

This is exactly it in a nutshell, thank you.

And I want to put this as nicely as possible, but just a bit of female perspective. When you say things like, "I checked the logs and you posted on this day and this day, etc." then you start to look a little creepy to the girl. She had tried the avoidance technique but you didn't take the hint. So you employ some light stalking to prove that she's wrong? Yeesh.

Originally Posted by m0nty

Yes, a woman is always allowed to change her mind, and no she doesn't have to justify it, but the man shouldn't have to guess. Communication is the key here.

Now be honest here. How many of you guys have done the "I'll call you" thing? How many of you have broken up with someone simply by becoming more and more distant and forcing her to dump you? Guys do the same thing! Yes, in a perfect world, we could look the other person in the face and say, "I'm sorry but there just isn't any connection here." I've been able to do that exactly once, and that was the last time because the look on his face was horrible. Men and women both cut off communication as a way to give the other person the hint. Do not pretend otherwise because you're either lying or deluding yourself.

[punk'n]

Originally Posted by m0nty

There should have been no "game" required of Erik. slampokes had said she would fuck him, end of story.

WRONG. I haven't even heard the show the show but this makes me want to side with slampokes. I shall listen and see what I think.