1439: Tough Titties

[DWarrior]

Shwoogies gonna shwoogie

[Medium Brumski]

Originally Posted by Junkenstein

still, most of the rioters seemed like people who would probably have guns themselves and eventually fire back. or use the guns FOR the looting. again, im PRO-gunbs, but when it comes to riots, i dont think they prevent them.

hmm, not really my point.

I think you're wrong about the mentality of looters, most people are there to steal and break shit, and it's a mob thing that just happens so you, A.) Don't have time to go get your gun (especially in England) and B.) Don't have murder as your intent. Really angry and purposeful riot-instigators might be different, but they're not the norm.

And I don't think a looter would fire back if they did have a gun. Imagine you're kicking in door/window of a house/store, your hear gunshots, you're not sure from where. Rather then pulling out your gun and going on a hunt, I'd bet you would just run, I would.

Don't British people have medieval arms and armour laying around the house? Someone's gonna end up with a halberd thru the chest.

[Junkenstein]

i'm not talking about the mentality of all looters, ive been told by local residents that most looters there were already young delinquents or gang members. so in that case guns wouldnt help.

plus, honestly, i dont think that if the police pulled something like in communist countries and just shot every rioter dead, it would be an improvement. if they started killing rioters, this would become some sort of guerrilla. although maybe it would be a solution. i really dont know.

[Junkenstein]

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

And I don't think a looter would fire back if they did have a gun. Imagine you're kicking in door/window of a house/store, your hear gunshots, you're not sure from where. Rather then pulling out your gun and going on a hunt, I'd bet you would just run, I would..

thats true, but still, someone would get killed and that could bring to an escalation. it happened in places where rioting was suppressed with brute force.

its a very delicate thing.

[Medium Brumski]

Originally Posted by Junkenstein

i'm not talking about the mentality of all looters, ive been told by local residents that most looters there were already young delinquents or gang members. so in that case guns wouldnt help.

Guns wouldn't help? Cause young gang members aren't scared of being shot?

Originally Posted by Junkenstein

plus, honestly, i dont think that if the police pulled something like in communist countries and just shot every rioter dead, it would be an improvement. if they started killing rioters, this would become some sort of guerrilla. although maybe it would be a solution. i really dont know.

Who said kill every rioter? If you're break into my house, I might shoot you, if you knew that, you might not break into my house.

I think we might be having a disconnect cause I'm talking about if a home-owner had a gun, and you seem to be saying what if the police/govt had guns.

Originally Posted by Junkenstein

thats true, but still, someone would get killed and that could bring to an escalation. it happened in places where rioting was suppressed with brute force.

Why did someone get killed? I said you heard a gunshot, doesn't automatically mean it was fired into a crowd. Warning shot. And again, I'm saying I, the home-owner, fired the shot, not a marching line of police for the mob to retaliate against.

[Junkenstein]

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

Guns wouldn't help? Cause young gang members aren't scared of being shot?.

i just think they'd just fire back. at least, thats what happens in countries where riots are suppressed by a military force (see Latin America)

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

Why did someone get killed? I said you heard a gunshot, doesn't automatically mean it was fired into a crowd. Warning shot. And again, I'm saying I, the home-owner, fired the shot, not a marching line of police for the mob to retaliate against.

i'm just thinkinbg that in a rioting situation, if i was a home owner and someone would come to my property i wouldnt discharge my weapon in the air, i would shoot to kill. and i think other will. and according to past history, that could bring to escalation.

as i said, i am in favour of guns. just saying that they dont improve the situation in riots. look at the Post Katrina looting for example. People looted, home owners shot at them, looters came back armed. lots of corpses.

you're thinking most would shoot to scare and cause to run off. I'd say a lot woulòd shoot to kill (nowing that they would be juistified to do so).

[JaymztheKing]

I'd just stay inside, per Keith's advice

[the_eD]

A fair insight into the rioting. Plan B's Message To The Rioters

This is Plan B, just incase you're ignant.

[Alekseyev]

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

Why did someone get killed? I said you heard a gunshot, doesn't automatically mean it was fired into a crowd. Warning shot. And again, I'm saying I, the home-owner, fired the shot, not a marching line of police for the mob to retaliate against.

Gotta go with Junkenstein on this one

In a large scale volatile situation, I think you're being very optimistic about everyone involved's ability to distinguish between a warning shot and someone being shot. The crowd may panic, causing deaths from trampling. Or if there's armed police or other armed individuals, they may hear the gunshot and assume they are being shot at causing them to fire into the crowd in what they think is self defense. Both situations have a long precedent in crowd control actions.

To your other point, if we're in the "guns OK" country, I think it's reasonable to assume that some number of rioters will be armed if some number of house/business owners will be armed. This is especially true if there is an expectation of this on both sides. If you're determined to do something that someone with a gun wants to stop you from doing, the reaction is not always going to be "Oh well, I better go home." A fair amount of the time it will be "better shoot him first"

[Medium Brumski]

All good points to my first post, unless I'm in a no guns country, I'm staying inside.

People get stupid and crazy and kill people without riots involved. The New York City Crime Report with Pat Dixon - Download free podcast episodes by Pat Dixon on iTunes.