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Keith 08-31-2012 10:25 PM

1645: The Civil War II
 
"This is the best time of all times. C'mon, let's face it."


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WSEIII 09-01-2012 11:13 AM

we're already in a civil war, it's crazy people with guns vs. the rest of us

no i don't think we should have a civil war, especially with nukes

but if we were what would we be fighting over:
gay rights?
pro-rights vs. pro choice?
coke vs. pepsi
east vs. west
etc.

JSZilla 09-01-2012 12:11 PM

The Ryan-Romney big shebang here, with Mr. Eastwood showing up later....Did anyone factcheck this bullshit? Hollllly crap. FactCheck.org and www.politifact.com almost makes me sad. For legitimate Republicans if they even exist anymore (not the crazies) aren't they ashamed at this bullshit? I could come up with several legitimate reasons you could call Obama out on. Yet, it's whether he was born here (still?!) he's a fuck up (the end lol) and taking something he said out of context therefore fuck'em. Like the whole Romney thing about liking to fire people. When one SHOULD be talking about what each guy plans to do with Healthcare, Economy, and War. But let's all just make shit up, make fun of the other guy, and then spin the opponent's words. This is exactly why I am beginning to stop watching any of this shit. Especially THAT side. Like the sick fucks I work with who use the word "Fag" and "Nigger" like the word "the". Oh, and they aren't racist or homophobic they'll say. Lmfao. Sigh. I voted no. Maybe I should ask for a re-vote. No,
I gotta better idea. Can we let the south succeed like they wanted years ago? NO TRADING with them! NO HELP! Let them be their own. PERIOD. I'll gladly move. (come next year I could technically lol) See how things evolve. Who goes to shit. Who doesn't. I think that sounds fair.

Fourbid 09-01-2012 12:25 PM

I think we could trick the south into passing every pro civil rights bill by adding "And I think fucking my family is right" into everything we want passed. The ballot would look like this:

Prop manlove

Yes (And I think fucking my family is right)
No (And I think fucking my family is wrong.)


All of a sudden gays can get married because incest is more important to them than persecuting gays.

Blitzgal 09-01-2012 01:08 PM

Remember seven months ago when they all hated Clint Eastwood's guts because he did a Superbowl ad that basically said, "Isn't it nice that the American car industry is starting to recover?" I do! I also remember Mitt Romney saying that we should let Detroit fail.

Fuck a civil war, I say let the assholes secede. Red states tend to take more in federal money than they pay in taxes. Let's see how long they last without being subsidized by the blue states.

Sparrow 09-01-2012 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourbid (Post 732303)
All of a sudden gays can get married because incest is more important to them than persecuting gays.

that's not a very nice thing to say. it's an easy joke to make, but you aren't joking.

Fourbid 09-01-2012 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow (Post 732306)
that's not a very nice thing to say. it's an easy joke to make, but you aren't joking.

They'll live.

Sparrow 09-01-2012 01:38 PM

you can think as you like, stereotypes exist, but you don't give a hoot to know my people and the words you say apply to myself, some of our favorite fellow KATGers, and the gay mountain youth i work with. there's a lot to laugh at, but you, my friend, believe it and are just being rude for shock value. carry on. we lost the war, right?

Electric Squirrel 09-01-2012 01:42 PM

Keith is right. By being a christian your supporting the bad things in the bible. Its like saying I disagree with the Nazis but I'll join them because they are good at uniting their community.

People say that Jesus was only about love. Now, even accepting that is true (by the way read your new testament, its not) the old testament is STILL PART OF THE BIBLE! Jesus says in Matthew 5:17 “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." All that crap in the old testament is part of your believes if you believe the bible is true.

Christianity is not a buffet where you skip the veggies and only take the meet. Its a stir fry where its all mixed together into one dish.

DaveNJ 09-01-2012 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow (Post 732310)
you can think as you like, stereotypes exist, but you don't give a hoot to know my people and the words you say apply to myself, some of our favorite fellow KATGers, and the gay mountain youth i work with. there's a lot to laugh at, but you, my friend, believe it and are just being rude for shock value. carry on. we lost the war, right?

What would you propose as the viable alternative to this?

Sparrow 09-01-2012 05:35 PM

be a regular person? i don't know. how do people reference Chemda's background without calling her a money hungry jew whose people need to be removed?

DaveNJ 09-01-2012 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow (Post 732321)
be a regular person? i don't know. how do people reference Chemda's background without calling her a money hungry jew whose people need to be removed?

So how do you think one should accurately denigrate the South for its past/present political and social positions? Or should this not even be discussed with respect to matters like Keith's hypothetical civil war?

rodimusprime 09-01-2012 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzgal (Post 732305)
Remember seven months ago when they all hated Clint Eastwood's guts because he did a Superbowl ad that basically said, "Isn't it nice that the American car industry is starting to recover?" I do! I also remember Mitt Romney saying that we should let Detroit fail.

Fuck a civil war, I say let the assholes secede. Red states tend to take more in federal money than they pay in taxes. Let's see how long they last without being subsidized by the blue states.

:):)

Dean from Australia 09-01-2012 09:41 PM

I was wrong.

And I was was inconsiderate of Danny in the sense that I didn't even give his shiw a try before passing a judgement on it. My initial remark was an off hand question without thought to Danny.

As a VIP I have the luxury of picking and choosing what content I listen to and what to pass on. And, as such, the right thing to do is not pass jisgement on something without giving it a try.

So in that vein I downloaded the second episode without knowing what the content was and listened to it. And I was shocked. That might be a fair or unfair reaction depending on your point of view but that was my point of view. And I reacted accordingly. It wasn't good - I was an arsehole for it.

So I thought about it. And I thought about all the times I've heard Danny on the core show and thought about how much I enjoyed him on those shows. He is funny and crazy. I've read Danny's blog. And he's a really good writer. I thought about what Keith said about Danny trying to make a go of it in NY.

So I listened to both Danny's shows in that context. I'll be listening again.

Keith 09-01-2012 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean from Australia (Post 732332)
My initial remark was an off hand question without thought to Danny.

You keep saying that, but, to be fair, Danny explained what got his goat.

Dean from Australia 09-01-2012 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 732335)
You keep saying that, but, to be fair, Danny explained what got his goat.

Keith - I was wrong...no excuses.

Keith 09-01-2012 11:24 PM

Just pointing out what is right.

But look: if you and Danny were both hanging off a cliff and I could only save one of you, I'd go out of my way to knock Danny off.

He'd like the attention.

Dean from Australia 09-01-2012 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 732337)
Just pointing out what is right.

But look: if you and Danny were both hanging off a cliff and I could only save one of you, I'd go out of my way to knock Danny off.

He'd like the attention.

Danny knows how I feel.

Bucho 09-02-2012 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean from Australia (Post 732332)
I was wrong.

And I was was inconsiderate of Danny in the sense that I didn't even give his show a try before passing a judgement on it. My initial remark was an off hand question without thought to Danny.

As a VIP I have the luxury of picking and choosing what content I listen to and what to pass on. And, as such, the right thing to do is not pass judgement on something without giving it a try.

So in that vein I downloaded the second episode without knowing what the content was and listened to it. And I was shocked. That might be a fair or unfair reaction depending on your point of view but that was my point of view. And I reacted accordingly. It wasn't good - I was an arsehole for it.

So I thought about it. And I thought about all the times I've heard Danny on the core show and thought about how much I enjoyed him on those shows. He is funny and crazy. I've read Danny's blog. And he's a really good writer. I thought about what Keith said about Danny trying to make a go of it in NY.

So I listened to both Danny's shows in that context. I'll be listening again.

Dean, I salute you.

Sparrow 09-02-2012 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveNJ (Post 732322)
So how do you think one should accurately denigrate the South for its past/present political and social positions?

Or should this not even be discussed with respect to matters like Keith's hypothetical civil war?

i understand my people and our history. we are blighted by our past and embarrassed by our trash. why do you feel like it's your right and duty to defame us all and deny the validity and importance of our current contributions? it's much easier to toss us all off as hillbillies than to have an actual conversation. i'm not even sure a conversation about it could take place without it devolving into barefoot and pregnant jokes. we are a vast, beautiful region and i am awful proud to be from here. my brother and i weren't raised in a hate culture nor have we fucked each other. there are good things here and good people fighting the stereotypes. it's my life's work. so, to answer how one should denigrate my people: how about let's not.


with respect to Keith's civil war--which, while dividing is the way wrong way to go about fixing our country (divided we fall, y'all)--the tension is excrutiatingly thick in our country and a good rumble and tumble would go a long way. men's physical release opens doors to more civil discourse. it'll start when someone pretty dies. don't worry. also, i believe the "other" side in the discussion included all the red states. it's funny how any reference to backward assholery reads FULL SOUTH to everyone. well, it's not funny. i get it. it's still not nice.

DaveNJ 09-02-2012 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow (Post 732351)
i understand my people and our history. we are blighted by our past and embarrassed by our trash. why do you feel like it's your right and duty to defame us all and deny the validity and importance of our current contributions? it's much easier to toss us all off as hillbillies than to have an actual conversation. i'm not even sure a conversation about it could take place without it devolving into barefoot and pregnant jokes. we are a vast, beautiful region and i am awful proud to be from here. my brother and i weren't raised in a hate culture nor have we fucked each other. there are good things here and good people fighting the stereotypes. it's my life's work. so, to answer how one should denigrate my people: how about let's not.


with respect to Keith's civil war--which, while dividing is the way wrong way to go about fixing our country (divided we fall, y'all)--the tension is excrutiatingly thick in our country and a good rumble and tumble would go a long way. men's physical release opens doors to more civil discourse. it'll start when someone pretty dies. don't worry. also, i believe the "other" side in the discussion included all the red states. it's funny how any reference to backward assholery reads FULL SOUTH to everyone. well, it's not funny. i get it. it's still not nice.

With respect to the first part: because while it's your history, it's also my history. A more removed part of my history, but it's still done under the banner of the United States, which makes your trash my trash and my trash your trash.

What is a good way to describe and accurately denigrate that garbage in casual conversation? What terms would make sense to adequately describe that particular sub-set of the shameful aspects of American history? I understand taking umbrage with claims of incest, but there's got to be a way to negatively describe a region where many state flags still have ties to the confederacy by virtue of popular mandate.

What terms or words would you find capable of capturing this negativity without also denying your contributions and those of your like-minded peers in the region?

Sparrow 09-02-2012 07:09 AM

oh! i understand. :)

it's not the verbiage, it's an attitude. i am very willing to go off on some redneck bullshit with you if i know you know that's what it is. it's the thin line between shared frustration and hate.

sklXbns 09-02-2012 11:11 AM

1 Attachment(s)
I don't know if those giant pull-down maps are even made anymore, but if they are, I should look into having this made.

Attachment 60301

dannyhatch 09-02-2012 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 732337)
Just pointing out what is right.

But look: if you and Danny were both hanging off a cliff and I could only save one of you, I'd go out of my way to knock Danny off.

He'd like the attention.

Working on my Keith accent for show number 3.

Keith 09-02-2012 08:21 PM

Let's remember who the true enemy is.

Dean's Australian for "tricky."

Dean from Australia 09-02-2012 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 732369)
Let's remember who the true enemy is.

Dean's Australian for "tricky."

Awww - come on Keith - you know I can't interpret those cryptic statements...

Keith 09-02-2012 09:02 PM

It's not about you. I'm in self-preservation mode.

angiethestrange 09-03-2012 10:28 AM

I can't express how much I agree with Keith. We need to fight back!! We need the racists and the homophobes to be so alienated that they wouldn't DARE express their narrow views in public. The same way a gay couple needs to hde their sexuality in the southern states. I think it needs to be so comfortable for them that they just shut the fuck up.

angiethestrange 09-03-2012 10:46 AM

... AND religion being to blame is 1000000% correct!! We need to abolish religion if we expect any forward movement because it allows people to justify their ignorant, and hateful views. THERE IS NOTHING ELSE IN THE WORLD THAT DOES THIS!!!

I don't care if some people can be good people and have religion because those people will be good people regardless ... we can no longer allow bad people to have a God and a "heaven" to look forward to as a result of their negative behaviour. It perpetuates it.

Religion NO longer has place or use in the modern world other than to oppress groups of people.

rodimusprime 09-03-2012 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angiethestrange (Post 732402)
... AND religion being to blame is 1000000% correct!! We need to abolish religion if we expect any forward movement because it allows people to justify their ignorant, and hateful views. THERE IS NOTHING ELSE IN THE WORLD THAT DOES THIS!!!

I don't care if some people can be good people and have religion because those people will be good people regardless ... we can no longer allow bad people to have a God and a "heaven" to look forward to as a result of their negative behaviour. It perpetuates it.

Religion NO longer has place or use in the modern world other than to oppress groups of people.

Some times I'm scared if you get rid of religion we'll be faced with an even scarier truth... that people just believe this bigoted nonsense not BECAUSE of religion but in spite of religion. I'm not sure it's religion that makes people racist, homophobic of xenophobic. I feel like it comes from somewhere even deeper than that and religion is just an easy way of explaining it and not feeling like it's "your fault."

angiethestrange 09-03-2012 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rodimusprime (Post 732403)
Some times I'm scared if you get rid of religion we'll be faced with an even scarier truth... that people just believe this bigoted nonsense not BECAUSE of religion but in spite of religion. I'm not sure it's religion that makes people racist, homophobic of xenophobic. I feel like it comes from somewhere even deeper than that and religion is just an easy way of explaining it and not feeling like it's "your fault."

I understand that, but facing the truth is better in my opinion. I feel that if people are honest then forward movement, and acceptance, is more possible. If you asked someone "why don't you want gays to get married?" and they say "The bible." then how can you argue? They have most likely been indoctrinated and brainwashed by religion and have lost the ability to think logically.

If they say "because it's gross/wrong/unnatural/perverted" these are all statements that can be fairly easily refuted. It may not convince them, but at least it is a step forward.

rodimusprime 09-03-2012 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angiethestrange (Post 732404)
I understand that, but facing the truth is better in my opinion. I feel that if people are honest then forward movement, and acceptance, is more possible. If you asked someone "why don't you want gays to get married?" and they say "The bible." then how can you argue? They have most likely been indoctrinated and brainwashed by religion and have lost the ability to think logically.

If they say "because it's gross/wrong/unnatural/perverted" these are all statements that can be fairly easily refuted. It may not convince them, but at least it is a step forward.

I feel you Angie. I think religion has been divisive and destructive myself. I guess I was just thinking of that second scenario you illustrated. I don't think we'd be able to convince people to leave their ignorance behind even if they weren't clutching their bibles or Korans or whatever.

Dean from Australia 09-03-2012 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angiethestrange (Post 732402)
Religion NO longer has place or use in the modern world other than to oppress groups of people.

Thankfully, adherence/devotion to organized religion is on the decline all around the world. It might take a while, but I think we will see in our life time, the collapse of organized religious faiths as people wake up and realize what wholesale fraud much of it is. It's already happening. Church parishes are going to the wall as attendences plummet and churches are having to amalgamate just to remain viable. Compensation claims against churches - both Prodestant and Catholic - are at an all time high and escalating as people call them out on their sins. People will only tolerate so much kiddy fucking until they start railing and baying for blood.

The Catholic and Prodestant will be reduced to the level of a cult and it will be apt to ask the question "Where's your Messiah now!?"

Leentron3030 09-03-2012 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sklXbns (Post 732355)
I don't know if those giant pull-down maps are even made anymore, but if they are, I should look into having this made.

Attachment 60301

NO!!! The PNW is way too awesome to be 'Merica. Besides, we have all of the best breweries.

Sparrow 09-03-2012 02:25 PM

religion is one of those places where we just can't damn have nice things. submission to service; radical love; forgiveness; mercy; grace. oneness. we're all headed somewhere--probably escaping as heat from our dead tissues--but, whatever it is we're doing, it gives meaning and gets done better when we do it together. Religion in times of lesser hysteria on a community level provides the safe space for those things to happen oftentimes being the only acceptable place to be vulnerable or get support during hard times. i think it was emotionally needful in my hometown for the miners to have a place to deal with their insides and a designated day to spend time with the reasons they were working so hard.

it's disappointing and in no way surprising we can't have these nice things stay nice.

Keith 09-03-2012 02:44 PM

And I think that's the point of an atheist group. What if you can have all of the above without the underlying NON-acceptance and hate?

THAT'S the point of atheist meetings. Because it's the meetings part that everyone really needs.

Sparrow 09-03-2012 03:38 PM

on the money, keet.

angiethestrange 09-03-2012 04:40 PM

That is it Sparrow! It's time be be like "no, you fucked it up... and now we're taking it away."

stulagu 09-03-2012 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSEIII (Post 732296)
we're already in a civil war, it's crazy people with guns vs. the rest of us

no i don't think we should have a civil war, especially with nukes

but if we were what would we be fighting over:
gay rights?
pro-rights vs. pro choice?
coke vs. pepsi
east vs. west
etc.

What did we fight over with the first civil war? the North making it hard for the South to make money.

Nightengale64 09-04-2012 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electric Squirrel (Post 732311)
Jesus says in Matthew 5:17 “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."

I wish that the Christians would remember this part of the bible. He never said that they should change the day of celebration from Saturday to Sunday. He wanted them to obey the old laws. There are some small groups of actual christians that worship the old holy days and on Saturday.

I am kind of biased being Wicca and wanting my holidays back. Easter, Halloween, Christmas, and the like I want back. Christ said nothing about putting up a tree in your house and clothing it. That is very pagan!


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