2010: Jagged Little Pill

[robotparker]

I'll just leave this here! Core Truths: 10 Common GMO Claims Debunked | Popular Science

[Keith]

And I won't click on it, smartypants.

I guess these companies have so many millions that lobbying congress to hide their ingredients is just for a goof.

Enjoy your perfectly fine food.

[robotparker]

I assume you're talking about major food distributors lobbying against mandatory GMO labeling? You're kind of creating a self-fulfilling prophecy here. Lots of consumers are caught up in largely unfounded anti-GMO hysteria and will refuse to buy a product if there's some indication on the label that an ingredient was genetically modified. But considering that identifying an ingredient as genetically modified doesn't convey any use technical information, and there's already a powerful regulatory body in place to keep genuinely harmful products out of the market place, coupled with the fact that most people don't really make any effort to educate themselves about these ingredients anyway, why force companies to take the extra expense of labeling and/or finding workarounds when it's just going to ultimately cause them to lose sales?

There's plenty of things to be mad at major food distributors about, but I'm not sure this should automatically be one of them.

[MichaelApproved]

Originally Posted by Keith

I think the giant food companies are very pleased with people like Michael's intellectualism.

When Michael gets cancer from his food and you guys being up this conversation though, I won't make it a big deal. I'm classy.

I don't know where you're coming from. Why would I get cancer from food any more than the next person? Do you think I'm being dismissive of "harmful" foods?

I'm not saying that there's no such thing as harmful foods. I'm saying that we should list the foods so the conversation is actually useful instead of just throwing around generic terms like "chemicals". If you tell me to avoid "chemicals", I wouldn't know how to do that. Tell me something that I can actually use when I'm shopping in the grocery store.

[Keith]

I'm on Spooky's side. That's all I know.

This reminds me of my pal (ex-)Intern Mike who went on and on about dieting and that all the books are wrong, and we can all eat whatever we want; it's simply about caloric intake. That said, I find out his "diet" consists of eating 2 lbs of cottage cheese only a day. (sometimes a little peach perhaps, to be fair)

Because that's what this culinary expert wannabe really enjoyed I guess.

I'd love to see THAT restaurant...

(And I'd pay. If all he did was sell giant bowls of cottage cheese there MUST be something to it.)

Michael can tell you why McDonald's isn't the sick company we all think it is. So there you have it. What can I tell ya.

[MichaelApproved]

Originally Posted by Keith

Michael can tell you why McDonald's isn't the sick company we all think it is. So there you have it. What can I tell ya.

When it comes to McDonalds vs random mom and pop, it'd bet mcdonalds was cleaner every time.

Rather than challenging me to tell you why mcdonalds isn't a sick company, please explain why it *is* a sick compnay. ::crickets::

[Keith]

Exactly. They're serving up crickets. At best.

[J. Canines]

Originally Posted by robotparker

...most people don't really make any effort to educate themselves about these ingredients anyway, why force companies to take the extra expense of labeling and/or finding workarounds when it's just going to ultimately cause them to lose sales?

This is an interesting argument. I agree that business should not lose sales due to consumer ignorance. This being said, any good business owner will tell you that educating your buyer is a priority. Your customer should be informed as to why your product is better.

If GMO's are the scientific achievement their defenders claim to be; why do they not proclaim it? Why are GMO's so secretive? It seems their only proponents are the Big Ag lobbyists in Washington. Companies like Monsanto,(who are on the forefront) have a horrible public track record.

You cannot claim that companies cannot 'afford' educating the public. The Food Industry spends literal billions on advertising. Are you suggesting that billion dollar corporations don't understand public relations?

Transparency in what we buy is an absolute necessity. It's what distinguishes us from lesser countries. The notion that American citizens are not capable of understanding vital, life-altering information like, "What's in the fucking box" is an argument I find infuriating, insulting, and just plain un-American.

[J. Canines]

Originally Posted by MichaelApproved

When it comes to McDonalds vs random mom and pop, it'd bet mcdonalds was cleaner every time.

This is an excellent point.

Large national success stories like McDonald's have proved they can feed our country efficiently and in a clean manner.

Now. If only the ability to use bleach and wipe a counter-top down were as important as: gigantic trash production, exporting said trash to developing countries, the subsequent choking out of local restaurants, and the fact 1 out of 3 Americans, (34.9%) are obese.

All our neighbors, friends and family are damn Oompa-loompahs. Sweating enough sugar and salt to feed themselves for 82 life times a piece.

America is a fat fuck, but the bathrooms are clean? Ok.

[jezna]

Originally Posted by J. Canines

This is an interesting argument. I agree that business should not lose sales due to consumer ignorance. This being said, any good business owner will tell you that educating your buyer is a priority. Your customer should be informed as to why your product is better.

If GMO's are the scientific achievement their defenders claim to be; why do they not proclaim it? Why are GMO's so secretive? It seems their only proponents are the Big Ag lobbyists in Washington. Companies like Monsanto,(who are on the forefront) have a horrible public track record.

You cannot claim that companies cannot 'afford' educating the public. The Food Industry spends literal billions on advertising. Are you suggesting that billion dollar corporations don't understand public relations?

Transparency in what we buy is an absolute necessity. It's what distinguishes us from lesser countries. The notion that American citizens are not capable of understanding vital, life-altering information like, "What's in the fucking box" is an argument I find infuriating, insulting, and just plain un-American.

The goal of agriculture is first and foremost to make a profit. We as a society have made it a point, through the FDA and EPA, to make sure that they don't hurt their customers or the environment.

Organic farming is incredibly inefficient. You lose a significant amount of your crops to bugs, rodents, weeds, etc. Organic products are also more likely to have salmonella and other bacteria. They also require significantly more labor and significantly pricier fertilizer. Organic farming is not a viable option for most of the world. We can't make bugs leave our food alone through sheer will.

Pesticides also pose a problem- the FDA regulates the amount of pesticide on fruits, and our bodies can actually handle the level of pesticides sold to us, but washing your fruit isn't a bad idea. The problem lies with the act of pesticide spraying. People living near farms that spray pesticides have a higher rate of autism. Also, pesticides are responsible for killing the bees. The pesticides also get into the soil, into the water, and have a lot of unintended consequences (mercury poisoning and so on).

So what the hell are we supposed to do? Hell, organic farming is inefficient as fuck, pesticides have too many unintended consequences. But we've been using these really cool tools to manipulate our crops for decades. We can introduce a gene into our corn that kills the bugs that eat our corn. This gene codes for a protein that is active at a high pH (in bugs stomachs) that will make bugs that try to eat it really sick. Luckily, mammals and other corn eating animals have low pH stomachs, which completely destroys this protein. There is no pesticide that gets into the water, there is no spraying the crops, bees do not eat corn. Win-win

We've also been able to create a pesticide that is easily destroyed by the bacteria in the ground (thus never making it to the rivers). And can literally be consumed by humans (yes, you can drink roundup). The problem is that it kills all the plants. What if we could introduce a single gene in plants (from the bacteria in the ground) that destroys this pesticide? This pesticide is clearly better than the ones we've been using.

Well because people have made up scary names for these crops. These energy efficient, pesticide reducing, organic growing crops to scare the bejeesus out of everyone. Monsato has had to jump through more hoops through the FDA and EPA than any other company. If regular crops had to jump through the same hoops, we wouldn't have potatoes (they make acrylamide, a neurotoxin), tomatoes, bananas (radioactive). Regular farmers love their crops because they don't get eaten by bugs.