2285: Follow the Money

[diluted]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Christianity is a majority, oppressive class in this country. deal with it. when you take that onto your shoulders, especially willingly, when you enjoy its privileges, it means a few things.

i feel like when you take on a label and associate yourself with a group, most any group, and people start representing you in the mainstream with views so undignified, it's your damn job to acknowledge that it's happening and do what you can to squash it. turning a blind eye and saying "well, not me" at this moment in time is how jews got burned in gas chambers close enough for the townspeople to see the smoke.

This I can agree with 100%. I get what you are saying, and it makes sense. I don't know how we go about addressing the believers who remain silent. I have no answer for that. I've been debating with myself for a while about the whole "label" aspect of it, but have never thought about it from the angle you propose. I still don't know how I feel about being aggressive to every believer though just because they are under that label. In my own personal experiences doing that has only pushed people away, or they just stop listening you know?

[AstoriaGirl]

Well, we can begin by acknowledging that any pushback against religion is shouted down as "aggression", whereas people are literally allowed to express the belief that people who think differently deserve to eternally burn, a belief that is in the bible multiple times, and get less criticism, because they're just "expressing their religion"

[diluted]

Originally Posted by AstoriaGirl

Well, we can begin by acknowledging that any pushback against religion is shouted down as "aggression", whereas people are literally allowed to express the belief that people who think differently deserve to eternally burn, a belief that is in the bible multiple times, and get less criticism, because they're just "expressing their religion"

Ok I think I am finally starting to see where it is you are coming from. Sorry for any misinterpretation I may have done.

So yes, I agree with what you are saying. I was coming at it from a different (i.e. wrong :-p) angle. I think Sparrow's post helped me get more insight into what you meant.

[MichaelApproved]

Haven't heard the episode yet but I believe that any amount of religion is harmful because it gives people a poor foundation for reason. Sure, not everyone who believes in religion is going around ISIS style but religious people have a strong cognitive dissonance which can hinder other life choices.

Also, this

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by diluted

I still don't know how I feel about being aggressive to every believer though just because they are under that label. In my own personal experiences doing that has only pushed people away, or they just stop listening you know?

this i will agree with. if you can't get the person you're talking to to really hear you, it's as fruitless as screaming into the wind. challenging anyone's core beliefs automatically puts one on some real deep defense; especially when that belief is built on purposely eschewing evidence to its contrary. you're /better/ at your Christianity the /more/ you deny damning truths. in dealing with Christianity, it can only really be meaningfully molded internally. it's why it's important to rely on our Faithful allies to keep their folks in check.

this is why moderate people of Faith cannot remain silent. Jesus defended most those his own people despised. it's your obligation to do the same.

[WittyReference]

Originally Posted by MichaelApproved

Haven't heard the episode yet but I believe that any amount of religion is harmful because it gives people a poor foundation for reason. Sure, not everyone who believes in religion is going around ISIS style but religious people have a strong cognitive dissonance which can hinder other life choices.

Yes and I think this is the same thinking that gets people into conspiracy theories. My problem with the religion talk was that it burried Mike's crazy conspiracy theory he brought up. If he'd explained that more then we would have known how poorly his reasoning works it would be easy to see why he's in to religion as well.

Within days of the Paris attacks I saw people claiming the whole thing had been faked and EODM where in on it for publicity. Disgusting.

My number one argument against any conspiracy theory is - humans are horrible at keeping secrets and love to let you know that they know something that you don't. NASA faked the moon landing? And out of the 100's of people it took to do that not one of them ever got drunk and blabbed? Yeah, right.

[thirteen]

I think it's just Chemda's tone that may be bothering people? She always has great points. It just comes across differently depending on how she's saying it. (and let's not forget Keith has a tone like that often depending on the subject, haha)

Kerryn Feehan is hilarious. I've always enjoyed her on Myka's show too.

Interesting mix of Kerryn and Mike on the show!

[nerdupyo]

I was confused when Chemda and Mike were arguing/debating. I agreed with Chemda almost the whole time but I think they went off on different broader tangents at some point and then I lost the thread of the conversation. I think Mike just annoys Chemda sometimes but I always love when he's on He's got some interesting theories and opinions. It would be boring if everyone on the show always agreed!

Kerryn is always hilarious but I voted for her as the crazier one because.... well just listen to any episode of anything she has ever been on and you will know why!

[Mattman]

Attacking someone's belief is such a futile activity. Saying that you are surprised that someone has religious beliefs because they are smart is also somewhat insulting.

From what I have experienced, many atheists are more prone to challenge believers, possibly because they have nothing but their own evidence-based rational thought process as a basis for what they believe in, rather than a shared "story" of faith to follow, along with many others.

I can only imagine how people in the trans community feel, and it is great that there is a growing awareness for the confusion of sex and gender that many people feel. But just because I am not in that community, I would not attack those who seek peace and comfort from the belief that sex and gender are different, and base that attack on the physical evidence of someone's genitalia rather than accepting their belief that they are the opposite gender.

It's a bit of a stretch to compare the two, but it does, I hope show the difference between fact and feeling, evidence and faith. What someone believes to be true, even in the absence of physical evidence should not be attacked by those who do not share that belief and cannot empathise with the other's feelings.

[Keith]

I'm not sure why it's in quotes, but what's your "story" of faith?