2406: Thoughts No Prayers

[dannyhatch]

with Danny Hatch – The Tony Awards and the Stanley Cup Final; Orlando’s mass shooting at a gay club; Keith’s wife completed a Spartan Race; a David Copperfield volunteer fell and sustained brain damage; the misconceptions of National Health Care; Miss California solves economic inequality; man receives $175 fine for giving a homeless man/undercover cop $3

Guest:
Danny Hatch



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[memecherry]

My brain melted a little once I started talking, so apologies if it was a little all over the place.. Still having a hard time processing the Orlando shooting.

All I kept feeling yesterday was how close to home it was hitting me.

I've been pretty much a shut in/hermit for many years unless somebody pushed me out of my comfort zone to go out and socialize because I wouldn't be alone, but in the last year I started going out by myself to drag shows and gay clubs because even by myself I never felt lonely. I always felt like I was at home.

On top of my LGBT brothers & sisters being targeted, it was latino night at an Orlando club, a heavily Puertorican populated area. Every time a name of a victim is released I breathe a sigh of relief that it is not an old school mate of mine, but in the same breath my heart breaks.

I don't know what else to say now, except thank you again... I was looking forward to hearing your voices... So, thank you.

[FingerLakes]

Can the one guy/gal who votes yes on this poll explain why?

also totally missed opportunity to have pictures of men kissing in the show notes to rebuke thoughts and prayers

[mkl]

I voted yes. Ar-15 (not an assault rifle. AR is the name of the company that made it) are cosmetically different than common hunting rifles, but operate the same way. They are not "machine guns" or "fully automatic" just like every hunting rifle, they shoot one bullet per time the trigger is pulled. Previous attempts to ban them (the Assault weapons ban- notice it's not "assault rifle ban") only do so by trying to pull out cosmetic features, such as pistol grips, barrel shrouds, etc that have little to no impact on function of the weapon. Studies of the previous AW ban have shown that it was overall ineffective, with most changes being statistically insignificant or a "mixed bag". The internal DOJ memo leaked sums up the AW ban with ..."Therefore a complete elimination of assault weapons would not have a large impact on gun homicides."
This makes sense since the entire category of "rifle" is used in less than 3-5% of crimes, the vast majority using handguns. The AR-15 is the most common rifle sold in the country, and it is involved in a very small amount of crimes. More people are killed with hands and blunt intruments than with ALL rifles put together in most years when looking at the past decade or so. Those crimes are however, very shocking and traumatic, so there is a lot of focus on this particular rifle. I do not believe banning this particular (or other) rifles will solve our problems in any way. I prefer to "strike the root" of causation of crimes, and not just band aids. I think banning one type (or multiple types) of weapons will do little to solve underlying issues causing violence, and would prefer to focus resources on things that will. For the over whelming majority of gun deaths (70%) that are suicides, I think spending resources on suicide prevention and counseling, and I'd love to hear more talk about solutions from people in the mental health field. Behind suicide, the vast majority of homicides using guns are in areas with poor education and no options driving people into lifestyles associated with crime- drugs, gangs etc. Resources spent lifting people out of poverty via education and jobs seems like a better way to spend our time, possibly in alignment with the end of the drug war. Again, I'd love to hear more talk from people in these research areas about how to tackle these underlying issues.

Basically, I think banning guns uses political capital the wrong way, and just creates more divisiveness that might feel good (yay we banned guns!) but will actually do little to save lives, and create another wedge to drive people further socially conservative. Let's figure out why people want to kill each other and try and fix that, not focus on the method.

[Keith]

I explained how the 10-year assault weapons ban, which the AR-15 WAS covered by, minimized deaths. Deaths were lowered 1/2 from the decade before and 1/3 after. Why are we guessing if a ban would work or not?

We know it would work because it did.

[Lanfear]

ohhhh well now that you told me that you just want to fix poverty, education and healthcare real quick I do understand why getting rid of guns is a stupid idea.

[Sparrow]

he's right, though. we /do/ have to fix some heart and mind problems. we are breeding our own monsters, they are in my backyard. i know you would love to pass some legislation and feel like the sun will come out, but i guarantee you without addressing the other things the make these monsters, they will proudly and quickly create a black market.

we have to come at this from /all/ the angles if we want lasting solutions. i know what you want to hear is all these people suddenly realizing the error of their ways, make a 180, and for this madness to stop, but the conversation can't be limited to gun legislation.

YES let's talk about poverty and how it relates. YES let's talk about mental health care. YES let's talk about taking it up from the root instead of aggressively sawing at branches.

if what we're doing isn't working (this merry go round of gun lesiglation), then let's try and make headway from another direction. there's not one magic solution. and it will take time. we can still work on the gun stuff in tandem.

[Keith]

I'll work on the gun stuff, you work on the health stuff.

This just in: mkl is going to work on poverty.

[Sparrow]

that's the beauty of many hands, my friend.

[Sparrow]

i will say, though, just as a suggestion, not to alienate the people who you're trying to change.