2742: Vice

[jcro21]

Sitting through this Dolphins Ravens game is WAY worse for you than Sunday mass or smoking cigarettes. But I'm still watching it. Football is an addiction

[Enunciated Piffle]

I'm too nerdy to be a football fan. But I'll watch it. Mostly cuz I'm a barfly and that's what's on.

I gotta say. Comparing organized religion to NFL, ( in terms of harm) is a ridiculous analogy. One professes love to all people, (the Jesus mythology) while clearly promoting judgement and division in its followers. The other has two fools running head long into another.

Yeah. Professional sports ravage your body. We're only recently discovering to what end. But come the on. There's no mystery or fuckery involved.

Ever decision you make has consequence. Some more obvious than others

[CigarettesREvil]

Ho boy. Keith did a great job of blaming cigarette smokers for their addictions in his defense of why he still watches the NFL. And his mocking of people who got addicted to cigarettes is really offensive.

Chemda, thanks for pushing back!

Some cigarette facts:

From the CDC:

Cigarette smoking is the leading preventable cause of death in the United States.

• Cigarette smoking causes more than 480,000 deaths each year in the United States. This is nearly one in five deaths.

• Smoking causes more deaths each year than the following causes combined:
o Human immunodeficiency virus (HIV)
o Illegal drug use
o Alcohol use
o Motor vehicle injuries
o Firearm-related incidents

• More than 10 times as many U.S. citizens have died prematurely from cigarette smoking than have died in all the wars fought by the United States.

• Smoking causes about 90% (or 9 out of 10) of all lung cancer deaths.More women die from lung cancer each year than from breast cancer.

• Smoking causes about 80% (or 8 out of 10) of all deaths from chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD).

• Cigarette smoking increases risk for death from all causes in men and women.

• The risk of dying from cigarette smoking has increased over the last 50 years in the U.S.

Smokers are at greater risk for diseases that affect the heart and blood vessels (cardiovascular disease).

• Smoking causes stroke and coronary heart disease, which are among the leading causes of death in the United States.

• Even people who smoke fewer than five cigarettes a day can have early signs of cardiovascular disease.

• Smoking damages blood vessels and can make them thicken and grow narrower. This makes your heart beat faster and your blood pressure go up. Clots can also form.

• A stroke occurs when:

o A clot blocks the blood flow to part of your brain;
o A blood vessel in or around your brain bursts.

• Blockages caused by smoking can also reduce blood flow to your legs and skin.1,2



Some more information – debatable, but I think the author puts forward good evidence- and you can do your own research at: Truth Tobacco Industry Documents

(for “fun” stuff try searching: ‘project scum’ / ‘starters’ (#11) / ‘Millennial Profile’ )

My source for stuff below: Golden Holocaust: Origins of the Cigarette Catastrophe and the Case for Abolition - by Robert N. Proctor

-The reason that most people think ‘cigarettes=cancer’ is because it is easier from a legal standpoint to link lung cancer to smoking.

-Cigarette companies were pioneers of modern advertising: lithography, movies/tv, cartoons, product placement, brand-linked ads, comics, radio.

- As Chemda touches upon in this episode, Cigarette companies used the armed forces to market cigarettes by including them in troop rations. There were generations of people who started their addictions while in the army…and there were children who wanted to be brave soldiers, who took the first step toward being “brave” by learning to smoke.

-Doctors (and veterans!) were used to sell cigarettes

-“More Doctors Smoke Camels”:

-Cigarettes were marketed as medicinal:

-Cigarette ads were in medicinal journals (but people who smoked cigarettes were just dumb/uneducated back then, right?)

-Cigarette companies made ads targeted toward children because they needed replacement smokers.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Read. Question. Learn.

Or don’t.

Ignorance is bliss in the era of Trump.

(On a side note, in the future, will we be treating former football players with CTE like people who get lung cancer from smoking the way we do today?

Will we call them stupid for tearing their bodies apart for money and fame and opportunity like we call people who picked up their cigarette addiction from a stint in the army, or from consuming media? It feels like we are reliving history right now in so many dumb ways, making the same mistakes over and over. With civil rights, with the environment, even with smoking, look back 100 years and you find people complaining about the same crap that we are struggling with today.

Oh, and by the way, Keith is totally wrong about his stance people who got suckered into the misinformation storm created by Cigarette companies, and for his stance on CTE and NFL players)

[Archimedes_Screw]

Y'all some verbose motherfuckers. Love the forums so much!

[JaymztheKing]

I'll use my monthly post to the forums on this one

This discussion sort of reminds me of trigger warnings. I personally hate them. I think the notion that the world needs to adjust to you is the pinnacle of narcissism. Doesn't mean that whatever trauma you experienced is legitimately upsetting and it doesn't mean that it is "fair" for things to trigger memories of that trauma, but that doesn't mean you can wish the things stacked against you. You have to live in an unfair world.

The exact same is true for unhealthy foods, cigarettes, etc. There is money to be made in selling you shit. The companies selling you their shit products are trying to deceive you. And they are good at it. They don't play by the rules. They target the poor with dollar menus. They target the uneducated by lobbying against nutritional information. They add addictive chemicals to make your body dependent. They are trying to fuck you. And they have billions of dollars at their disposal to make that happen.

All of that said, the onus is still on you. At some point you made the decision to light up the cigarette or eat the Big Mac. Maybe you didn't have all the facts. Maybe you thought it wasn't unhealthy. Maybe you couldn't afford a healthier option. Maybe you didn't even think about it. It may not be fair that you don't have the information or the resources to make a better decision, but you have to play the cards you're dealt. Regardless of the fairness, your decisions (and the consequences there of) are yours and yours alone. If you find out after the fact that you fucked up and made the wrong choice, you still have to deal with the consequences. It's not fair. The world is a shitty place. But it is your responsibility to live in it.

See you in November

[JaymztheKing]

That said Keith's notion that he specifically would have known better at the time is retarded. His how could breathing in smoke be healthy for you is the exact same argument Anti-Vaxxers use. "How could injecting a virus and preservatives be good for you durrrr?" Intuition can fuck you over just as hard as medical science

[Binkers]

Yeah there is a lot of BS information out there. Anyone with any monetary interest is going to lie their fucking face off to get people to buy their shit. That's why, horrible as it is, you can't just take what you find in a study as true. Even scientists are bought off, because they have to live somehow.

That's why Keith said, listen to your body. If you smoke, it feels bad in your body. If you eat junk, it feels bad in your body. Even drugs that feel so amazing in the moment will have a crash, or make you nauseous, or hungover, or lose your teeth. Your body won't lie to you like other people will.

But yeah...victim culture is popular these days.

Also, I think whatever changes Keith is going through right now, including the quitting drinking thing, comes from the disintegration of his marriage. Divorce traumatizing and it changes you. First there is the long, slow decline of the relationship and all the heartache that goes with that, then there is the aching void that you have to deal with even if it's a relief to be done with fighting. At least he's going alcohol sober and working out, that will help. Weed will slow the process though I think, keeps you from processing you emotions (feels good though...)

[FingerLakes]

I think Keith has gotten more opinionated and standoffish on air. Like...more snarky?

There have also been more emotional and "real" discussions but he's always been more open to that kinda stuff than most guys. I think the increase there is just the topics and the guests who share divorce/fucked up family stories.

[Scorpion]

oh Keith, so you think that having broken legs and torn ligaments daily should have some connection to brain damage. Is that where you are going? Players were/are not daily taken off the field for head trauma, very much the opposite they were sat down and put back out there after a short rest. I expected a better argument from you. "and the Lord said unto his flock though shall not compare banana's to pomegranate."

[Keith]

As if I thought every thing on their body was breaking but somehow just not their heads?