3539: The Nicest Title Ever

[Keith]

Keith and Chemda discuss the white supremacist shooting in a Buffalo, NY supermarket that killed 10 people. (19 weeks into the year, America has already seen 198 mass shootings.) The duo also talks about R. Kelly and NYC subway shooter Frank James being prison pals. Keith discusses Netflix’s Meltdown: Three Mile Island, which leads to covering the makeup of sociopaths, psychopaths, and Keith’s dad.

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[vezione]

180 page manifesto --- and imagine there's PhD students right now struggling to write their dissertation.

[nordcharonmir]

Originally Posted by vezione

180 page manifesto --- and imagine there's PhD students right now struggling to write their dissertation.

Appears to be 90% copy paste either from memes from the internet, other manifestos, or just straight aggregating info from manufacturer sights and reviews...If only I coulda got away with copy pasting 90% of my dissertation

[vezione]

Appears to be 90% copy paste either from memes from the internet, other manifestos, or just straight aggregating info from manufacturer sights and reviews...If only I coulda got away with copy pasting 90% of my dissertation

Thank you for putting it into perspective.

[nordcharonmir]

Points of clarification from this episode;

1. He used an AR-15 chambered in 556. I haven't seen anything that indicates the guard was wearing body armor too. Level III will stop this round, almost all commercially available armor is III or above.

2. This gun type used for hunting; it isn't used for hunting deer, elk, moose etc b/c it is an under powered round. That is why almost all hunting rifles are chambered in higher calibers. 556 and 223, which is what AR-15's shoot are vermin and anti-personnel rounds. Second amendment isn't about hunting, it's about the perceived ability to resist tyranny.

3. Chemda's point about pro gun people saying if others were armed the bad guy would have been taken down. This was an express reason why he attacked where he did, he feared that in other places as a CCW holder might take him out too early.

4. Threatened to shoot up the school and was dismissed - wrong, he was on the FBI's Active Terrorist Watchlist. 1 of 6 "in the region" not sure if that means county or Upstate or what. He was required additional mental care, was required by NY state law that the professional reporting mechanisms report him to authorities and the red flag database which requires all sorts of follow ups etc. I can't get a second source on this but also saw he was even on the no fly list.

5. Threatened to do a shooting at Grad - true also threatened earlier in the year which put him on the initial local PD watchlists, additional threats escalated it to FBI wathlists. Also wore a full hazmat suit and gas mask for a week and told multiple witnesses it was because he was putting poison in the HVAC system, when reported he told faculty it was due to being scared about coronavirus.

6. Shootings in real life take seconds or a minute - Correct, the average is 3 seconds at a distance of about 3 feet with 3 shots fired.

7. So many mass shootings this year - Correct but check your numbers - may be using inaccurate definitions (4 or more casualties not counting the shooter is technical definition) - actually 273 since 2009, 61% occurred in private residents, 1 in 3 perpetrator were prohibited from firearm ownership, most weapons were owned illegally, more than half of perpetrators showed many signs that would allow red flag laws, more than half are domestic abusers (not counted above as warning signs), 16% of mass shootings using what NY defined as an "assault weapon", only 1 has actually used an assault weapon - illegally obtained through military. This one is highlighted and will be a media mainstay even though way more people were killed in Milwaukee in mass shootings the same weekend but those aren't as useful narratives.

8. 180 page manifesto - correct but only about 5 pages of original writing. Mostly filled with memes, product information and copies of other manifestos.

9. Keith's maliciously ending his quote on location motive - full quote "(REDACTED) has the highest black population percentage and isn't that far away. [Keith stopped here conveniently] Plus NY has heavy gun laws so it would ease me if I know that any legally armed civilian was limited to 10 round magazines or cucked firearms."

10. He has online advocacy of far right interests -

Originally Posted by nordcharonmir

I 100% agree with you that his main issue was racism. Racism and politics are exclusive ideas despite the fact that many political ideologies try to leverage racism, but they are still two different things. BUT...my point was that the media is intentionally misleading their audiences about the political motivation. Example - Almost every single media outlet has called this guy Alt Right, or Right Extremist. Though his manifesto is totally written from a far left perspective (mostly copy and pasted from another far left author but the new additions here are in the same path) as in making everything about racism (this is a cornerstone of postmodernism), he even openly admits to his political believes which minimizes the readers duty to understand poli psy;

"On the political compass I fall in the mild-moderate authoritarian left category, and I would prefer to be called a populist."

11. Far right means murder, far left means marry my couch - Incorrect, most shooting perpetrators who have political leanings are left of center and also more likely to want to fuck their couch. Including this one see above.

12. Why are white people so afraid of being the minority - they aren't, only psychopaths. Also, white people have been the minority in the USA for some time already. Only when "white" includes everyone with lighter skin are they attributed with majority.

[vezione]

TLR - in situations like this where the person who did it says they have abhorrent views, who are you setting the record for? Cause a lot of this seems MINOR compared to this dude saying he thinks minority are causing the problem.

And white people - having been born into the system of racism seldom think outside themselves (aka "the norm") to consider how their thoughts, actions could be inspired by racist ideas.

And NO. Most domestic violence is committed by RIGHT-WING ideas. The NY Times crunched the numbers.

You sound like an apologist, but I'd like to give you the opportunity to say which side you're actually on.

[Keith]

"The New York Times? The 8th Wonder of the World? Yeah right ... "

[nordcharonmir]

Originally Posted by vezione

TLR - in situations like this where the person who did it says they have abhorrent views, who are you setting the record for? Cause a lot of this seems MINOR compared to this dude saying he thinks minority are causing the problem.

You sound like an apologist, but I'd like to give you the opportunity to say which side you're actually on.

TLDR yet you've decided I sound like an apologist...how do you know if you didn't read it? Just to make it easy for you, this was my very first written reaction on these boards:

Originally Posted by nordcharonmir

Absolutely disgusting stuff. Terrorist surrendered instead of killing himself like he planned, as a society the right thing to do is get a short rope and tall tree.

Further to the point that you didn't read it...you are responding as if I'm setting the record on his views??? Nope! Just correcting factually inaccurate statements made on the show in this episode, I at no time advocated for the piece of shit shooter's views...maybe read it then respond.

Originally Posted by vezione

And white people - having been born into the system of racism seldom think outside themselves (aka "the norm") to consider how their thoughts, actions could be inspired by racist ideas.

Please elaborate on what you mean by a system of racism. Is in group bias strictly a "white" race phenomenon?

Originally Posted by vezione

And NO. Most domestic violence is committed by RIGHT-WING ideas. The NY Times crunched the numbers.

What? I didn't say left ideology caused domestic violence...again, read the thing you are responding to before responding. What I sad:

Originally Posted by nordcharonmir

11. Far right means murder, far left means marry my couch - Incorrect, most shooting perpetrators who have political leanings are left of center and also more likely to want to fuck their couch. Including this one see above.

I see how maybe you conflated how more than half are domestic abusers but if half (right v left) of half are left leaning....that math doesn't work for your point. I would love to see this NYT number crunch if you have a link since this does not align with any source documentation, super interested how they got there. My guess is they played the game they are playing here and labeling a far left motive as Alt Right. If you label everything right whether it is or not then of course the conclusion will be what you designed it to be from the outset.

[vezione]

You said, "most shooting perpetrators with political leanings are left of center." I ask for your source because that doesn't mesh with the information I have. I was clumsy in my usage of "domestic violence" because I didn't mean it in the context you took. I was more referring to "domestic terrorism." I did not mean domestic abusers. Here's a link to the Times story and I recognize they're using analysis from another source: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/17/b...tings.amp.html

The claim that racism is a cornerstone of postmodernism is wrong. Postmodernism seeks to include voices and perspectives that up until this point have often been left out of the discussion. If those oft-ignored voices lament the racism they've experienced, I can see how racism could seem like a central tenant. But it is not though it should be indictive of something larger in the culture. That is, the US is racist. (Also, because authoritarianism fall to the right of most types of governance, I do question if you can legitimately call yourself an authoritarian leftist. That's probably a different conversation, though.)

Which bring me to systemic racism. I do not think that being ignorant of structural racism in this country precludes anyone from acting racist within that structure. Why? Because it was built by white people that privileges the white experience while creating systems that hinder other people from succeeding. White supremacy isn't about white people as a majority. It is the belief that white people are inherently better and deserve to be in control because of that. I brought that up to address this:

Why are white people so afraid of being the minority - they aren't, only psychopaths. Also, white people have been the minority in the USA for some time already. Only when "white" includes everyone with lighter skin are they attributed with majority.

There is something real behind people's reaction to being called "racist." First, I think because structural racism hasn't been explained to them or they reject it, they are unaware of the ways the system benefits them at the exclusion of others. But also, because they get lumped into a group of people you call "psychopaths." I don't know of many people who want to be psychopaths, and by equating psychopathy with racism, people will be even less likely to consider anything they do as racist. That said, a person's racism can be casual. And yes, I have dealt in racism in the past. I may have been unaware of a particular racist history but that does not mean the effect was not still the same. I bought a line handed down through history that hurts somebody else. I can either dig my boots (or whatever fabulous footwear I have) into the ground or recognize that because I still interact in a society, the things I say and do affect other people and can choose to stop doing the best I can. If it's not clear, let me say, I do not think most people are "racist" but most people participate in things that have racial/racist histories. How you react to that news is the important thing to me.

I'm using my phone so my responses aren't as elaborate and succinct as I'd like - but that's my fault. (Also long covid has taken a toll on my brain as I usually have to do a bunch of editing to get my points across. I didn't do that here. It's mostly the stream from my brain which often doesn't make sense anymore.)

[vezione]

Originally Posted by Keith

"The New York Times? The 8th Wonder of the World? Yeah right ... "

My bad, I'll be sure to include a Post story next time. 😄