992: Keith is a Drunk

sully_04 · 07-01-2009, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Galt

Agreed. Sully is someone I would totally drink with.

anytime brother.

King of Assholes · 07-01-2009, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sully_04

If you freaks really honestly care about Keith and this issue, stop telling your story and giving your uneducated opinions, as recovering freaks you know you are powerless over it, stop trying to control yourself vicariously through Keith Malley.

Yeah but in the same way I could say someone making your argument, or similar ones seen here, is using their own definition of alcoholism to excuse their own drinking problem through defense of Keith. I think some people here are defining alcoholism by the behavior seen at ones "bottom".

For me when I got to my worst point I was just a pretty ridiculous person to be blunt. However for a long time before that I was viewed by other and myself as just a hard drinking/partying guy. It's like with retards, there are high-functioning developmentally disabled people, there are high-functioning alcoholics as well. The difference is alcoholics can get worse, retards level off.

MaxxedMan · 07-01-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sully_04

I will play drink tracker with you as well.
4 Miller Light, 12oz bottles. (after work).

I went to bed at 2am with a BAC of .18 according to drink tracker. I got up 6 hours later and it was still showing a .1, over the legal limit to drive. It's noon now and its showing 0.06 ...

Either this thing uses bad math, or I'm at least a little drunk 24 hours a day...

11 Drinks in 18 hours 50 minutes (11 of them between 5pm and 2am yesterday)

sully_04 · 07-01-2009, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King of Assholes

Yeah but in the same way I could say someone making your argument, or similar ones seen here, is using their own definition of alcoholism to excuse their own drinking problem through defense of Keith. I think some people here are defining alcoholism by the behavior seen at ones "bottom".

For me when I got to my worst point I was just a pretty ridiculous person to be blunt. However for a long time before that I was viewed by other and myself as just a hard drinking/partying guy. It's like with retards, there are high-functioning developmentally disabled people, there are high-functioning alcoholics as well. The difference is alcoholics can get worse, retards level off.

there are people that dont drink that are alcoholics, you are defining this based on function, consumption, perception, there are no levels. you either are or you are not.

MaxxedMan · 07-01-2009, 11:36 AM

I still say if you are high functioning, you aren't an alcoholic, but apparently, every doctor in the online world is conspiring against me.

Pasted from Psychology Today

When the term "high-functioning alcoholic" is mentioned, various types of drinkers often begin to question their own drinking and worry if they fall into this category. Part of this confusion is that many individuals are unclear about the differences in characteristics of social drinkers, problem drinkers and alcoholics. There is also a lack of awareness of what the true warning signs of alcoholism are.

Social drinkers are those individuals who drink in low-risk patterns. According to the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism (NIAAA), "low-risk" drinking for females consists of no more than 7 drinks per week and no more than 3 drinks per sitting. For males, it consists of no more than 14 drinks per week and no more than 4 drinks per day.

Problem drinkers display clear differences between their drinking habits and those of alcoholics. In fact, according to the NIAAA, 72% of people have a single period of heavy drinking that lasts 3-4 years and peaks at ages 18-24 (typically occurs during the college years) that they phase out of. When problem drinkers are given sufficient reason to cut back on their drinking (ie, have a negative drinking consequence, debilitating hangover, becomes a parent), they are able to self-correct and return to drinking in a low-risk manner. In contrast, alcoholics may be given countless reasons to cut back on their drinking but they are unable to permanently cut back on their drinking. Alcoholics may have occasions where they drank in a low-risk manner, but they inevitably return to their alcoholic drinking patterns. High-functioning alcoholics (HFAs) in particular tend to minimize their drinking by falsely labeling it as a "problem" or as "heavy" drinking because they often do not believe that they fit the stereotype of the typical alcoholic. However, what defines an alcoholic is a person's relationship to alcohol and not how they appear to the outside world in terms of their personal, professional or academic life.

Some of the following alcoholism warning signs are tailored to HFAs but are applicable to all subtypes of alcoholics and include but are not limited to:
1. inability to control alcohol intake after starting to drink
2. obsessing about alcohol (ie, next time the person can drink, how they are going to get alcohol, who they're going to go out drinking with)
3. behaving in ways, while drunk, that are uncharacteristic of their sober personality.
4. repeating unwanted drinking patterns
5. surrounding themselves socially with heavy drinkers
6. getting drunk before actually arriving at parties/bars (pre-partying)
7. increasing sense of denial that their heavy drinking is a problem because they are able to succeed professionally and personally
8. setting drinking limits (ie, only having 3 drinks, only drinking 3 days per week) and not being able to adhere to them
9. driving drunk and, by sheer luck, not getting arrested or involved in an accident
10. always having to finish an alcoholic beverage or even another person's unfinished beverage
11. using alcohol as a reward
12. drinking daily
13. living a double life by separating drinking life from professional or home life
14. binge drinking (more than 5 drinks in one sitting)
15. having chronic blackouts (memory lapse due to excessive drinking) and not remembering what they did for a portion of their drinking episode
16. feeling guilt and shame about their drunken behaviors
17. taking breaks from drinking and then increasing alcohol consumption when they resume drinking after a period of time
18. people have expressed concern about their negative drunken behaviors
19. engaging in risky sexual behavior when intoxicated
20. not being able to imagine their life without alcohol in it

If individuals display a number of these warning signs, it is important for them to address this issue. Finding someone in their lives that they can be honest with and admit they need help, can assist individuals in beginning this process. In addition, speaking with someone in the mental health or health care field, such as a therapist or social worker (preferably an addiction specialist) and/or medical doctor can help potential alcoholics receive a thorough assessment of their drinking patterns and provide suggestions for appropriate treatment. There is no harm in at least checking out an abstinence-based program such Alcoholics Anonymous, SMART Recovery® or Women for Sobriety meetings. Each of these recovery programs has members who are HFAs as well as lower functioning alcoholics. Meetings are held in person as well as online and are typically listed on their Websites. It is most important for alcoholics to realize that they are NOT alone and that there are millions of sober alcoholics who now have fulfilling lives without drinking.

Lord of the Cock Rings · 07-01-2009, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxxedMan

I still say if you are high functioning, you aren't an alcoholic, but apparently, every doctor in the online world is conspiring against me.

Yah, well it IS in the treatment/ addiction doctors' best interests to promote treatment for people.

sully_04 · 07-01-2009, 12:38 PM

Chemda said, "your drinking too much, your an alcoholic"

I am saying it isnt how much you drink, its how and why you drink(do drugs or whatever) that define your disease. Plenty of people for thousands of years have consumed alcohol and not been alcoholics. She is coming from a personal palace and worried about him and sees her own penchant for addiction and applies it to Keith and not wanting him to be this way. She is projecting her fear of addiction, its not a judgment or a flaw, it is obviously from a place of love, not ball breaking. I believe Keith know his limits and sees truth in the mirror, if he didnt he would never have put the crack down. I would like to believe that when we are PSP'ing, we are all having fun, doing it from a fun place, enjoying ourselves. I dont think, but do not fully know, that Keith is drinking from the emotional place that puts so many partiers over the edge and transforms them into a full blown mess.

The emotional element behind your drinking/drugging is the factor that makes what you are doing a problem. Regulating your emotions with substances that alter your reality will become a problem for you and all those around you. Maybe Keith really is distraught over his relationship with his father and is drinking to numb the pain?

Maybe not.

For me, as soon as I realize that I am partying with a person who is doing this through drugs or alcohol, I will not drink with them at least at that moment and sometimes never again.

I have spent years and years of my life around many many people who are hot emotional messes regulating their inability to cope with life and the world and their own shitty decisions with booze or drugs, I just dont see it in this dude.

"if you know you are losing your soul, you still have one left to lose"

Charles Bukowski wrote that and he was more fucked up the 10,000 Keith Malleys.

John Galt · 07-01-2009, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sully_04

Chemda said, "your drinking too much, your an alcoholic"

I am saying it isnt how much you drink, its how and why you drink(do drugs or whatever) that define your disease. Plenty of people for thousands of years have consumed alcohol and not been alcoholics. She is coming from a personal palace and worried about him and sees her own penchant for addiction and applies it to Keith and not wanting him to be this way. She is projecting her fear of addiction, its not a judgment or a flaw, it is obviously from a place of love, not ball breaking. I believe Keith know his limits and sees truth in the mirror, if he didnt he would never have put the crack down. I would like to believe that when we are PSP'ing, we are all having fun, doing it from a fun place, enjoying ourselves. I dont think, but do not fully know, that Keith is drinking from the emotional place that puts so many partiers over the edge and transforms them into a full blown mess.

The emotional element behind your drinking/drugging is the factor that makes what you are doing a problem. Regulating your emotions with substances that alter your reality will become a problem for you and all those around you. Maybe Keith really is distraught over his relationship with his father and is drinking to numb the pain?

Maybe not.

For me, as soon as I realize that I am partying with a person who is doing this through drugs or alcohol, I will not drink with them at least at that moment and sometimes never again.

I have spent years and years of my life around many many people who are hot emotional messes regulating their inability to cope with life and the world and their own shitty decisions with booze or drugs, I just dont see it in this dude.

"if you know you are losing your soul, you still have one left to lose"

Charles Bukowski wrote that and he was more fucked up the 10,000 Keith Malleys.

/ nods in the background

tocksin · 07-01-2009, 04:49 PM

This whole thread/show is stupid. Chemda has had over 6 years to change Keith. If she hasn't by now, she's not going to. Take him or leave him.

LikesPain · 07-01-2009, 07:01 PM

I just listened to this episode and I thought it was a super awesome show. This show is what I've been missing from KATG for a while now. It was just Keith and Chemda, it was raw, and it was real. You could hear how much Chemda loves Keith and how scared she is for him.

I miss when it was mostly just the two of them with guests on the show once or twice a week. I miss the days when you could hear in the way they spoke about eachother their love for eachother. It's part of what made me love the show. Until today's show I hadn't heard that for a very long time.

View Poll Results: Will today's show change Keith's drinking habits in the long run?
Yes	48	13.01%
No	321	86.99%
Voters: 369. You may not vote on this poll

07-01-2009, 11:36 AM	#115 (permalink)
MaxxedMan Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 259	I still say if you are high functioning, you aren't an alcoholic, but apparently, every doctor in the online world is conspiring against me. Pasted from Psychology Today When the term "high-functioning alcoholic" is mentioned, various types of drinkers often begin to question their own drinking and worry if they fall into this category. Part of this confusion is that many individuals are unclear about the differences in characteristics of social drinkers, problem drinkers and alcoholics. There is also a lack of awareness of what the true warning signs of alcoholism are. Social drinkers are those individuals who drink in low-risk patterns. According to the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism (NIAAA), "low-risk" drinking for females consists of no more than 7 drinks per week and no more than 3 drinks per sitting. For males, it consists of no more than 14 drinks per week and no more than 4 drinks per day. Problem drinkers display clear differences between their drinking habits and those of alcoholics. In fact, according to the NIAAA, 72% of people have a single period of heavy drinking that lasts 3-4 years and peaks at ages 18-24 (typically occurs during the college years) that they phase out of. When problem drinkers are given sufficient reason to cut back on their drinking (ie, have a negative drinking consequence, debilitating hangover, becomes a parent), they are able to self-correct and return to drinking in a low-risk manner. In contrast, alcoholics may be given countless reasons to cut back on their drinking but they are unable to permanently cut back on their drinking. Alcoholics may have occasions where they drank in a low-risk manner, but they inevitably return to their alcoholic drinking patterns. High-functioning alcoholics (HFAs) in particular tend to minimize their drinking by falsely labeling it as a "problem" or as "heavy" drinking because they often do not believe that they fit the stereotype of the typical alcoholic. However, what defines an alcoholic is a person's relationship to alcohol and not how they appear to the outside world in terms of their personal, professional or academic life. Some of the following alcoholism warning signs are tailored to HFAs but are applicable to all subtypes of alcoholics and include but are not limited to: 1. inability to control alcohol intake after starting to drink 2. obsessing about alcohol (ie, next time the person can drink, how they are going to get alcohol, who they're going to go out drinking with) 3. behaving in ways, while drunk, that are uncharacteristic of their sober personality. 4. repeating unwanted drinking patterns 5. surrounding themselves socially with heavy drinkers 6. getting drunk before actually arriving at parties/bars (pre-partying) 7. increasing sense of denial that their heavy drinking is a problem because they are able to succeed professionally and personally 8. setting drinking limits (ie, only having 3 drinks, only drinking 3 days per week) and not being able to adhere to them 9. driving drunk and, by sheer luck, not getting arrested or involved in an accident 10. always having to finish an alcoholic beverage or even another person's unfinished beverage 11. using alcohol as a reward 12. drinking daily 13. living a double life by separating drinking life from professional or home life 14. binge drinking (more than 5 drinks in one sitting) 15. having chronic blackouts (memory lapse due to excessive drinking) and not remembering what they did for a portion of their drinking episode 16. feeling guilt and shame about their drunken behaviors 17. taking breaks from drinking and then increasing alcohol consumption when they resume drinking after a period of time 18. people have expressed concern about their negative drunken behaviors 19. engaging in risky sexual behavior when intoxicated 20. not being able to imagine their life without alcohol in it If individuals display a number of these warning signs, it is important for them to address this issue. Finding someone in their lives that they can be honest with and admit they need help, can assist individuals in beginning this process. In addition, speaking with someone in the mental health or health care field, such as a therapist or social worker (preferably an addiction specialist) and/or medical doctor can help potential alcoholics receive a thorough assessment of their drinking patterns and provide suggestions for appropriate treatment. There is no harm in at least checking out an abstinence-based program such Alcoholics Anonymous, SMART Recovery® or Women for Sobriety meetings. Each of these recovery programs has members who are HFAs as well as lower functioning alcoholics. Meetings are held in person as well as online and are typically listed on their Websites. It is most important for alcoholics to realize that they are NOT alone and that there are millions of sober alcoholics who now have fulfilling lives without drinking.
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07-01-2009, 12:38 PM	#117 (permalink)
sully_04 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 579	Chemda said, "your drinking too much, your an alcoholic" I am saying it isnt how much you drink, its how and why you drink(do drugs or whatever) that define your disease. Plenty of people for thousands of years have consumed alcohol and not been alcoholics. She is coming from a personal palace and worried about him and sees her own penchant for addiction and applies it to Keith and not wanting him to be this way. She is projecting her fear of addiction, its not a judgment or a flaw, it is obviously from a place of love, not ball breaking. I believe Keith know his limits and sees truth in the mirror, if he didnt he would never have put the crack down. I would like to believe that when we are PSP'ing, we are all having fun, doing it from a fun place, enjoying ourselves. I dont think, but do not fully know, that Keith is drinking from the emotional place that puts so many partiers over the edge and transforms them into a full blown mess. The emotional element behind your drinking/drugging is the factor that makes what you are doing a problem. Regulating your emotions with substances that alter your reality will become a problem for you and all those around you. Maybe Keith really is distraught over his relationship with his father and is drinking to numb the pain? Maybe not. For me, as soon as I realize that I am partying with a person who is doing this through drugs or alcohol, I will not drink with them at least at that moment and sometimes never again. I have spent years and years of my life around many many people who are hot emotional messes regulating their inability to cope with life and the world and their own shitty decisions with booze or drugs, I just dont see it in this dude. "if you know you are losing your soul, you still have one left to lose" Charles Bukowski wrote that and he was more fucked up the 10,000 Keith Malleys. __________________ my hate will be distributed equally among you all.
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07-01-2009, 04:49 PM	#119 (permalink)
tocksin Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Hudson, OH Posts: 210	This whole thread/show is stupid. Chemda has had over 6 years to change Keith. If she hasn't by now, she's not going to. Take him or leave him.
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07-01-2009, 07:01 PM	#120 (permalink)
LikesPain Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Midland, TX Posts: 108	I just listened to this episode and I thought it was a super awesome show. This show is what I've been missing from KATG for a while now. It was just Keith and Chemda, it was raw, and it was real. You could hear how much Chemda loves Keith and how scared she is for him. I miss when it was mostly just the two of them with guests on the show once or twice a week. I miss the days when you could hear in the way they spoke about eachother their love for eachother. It's part of what made me love the show. Until today's show I hadn't heard that for a very long time.
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