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Old 04-26-2010, 07:19 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by da_ticklah View Post
Bullshit you dont even believe that try telling every texan they must walk around with ID and be subject to random queries and they will secede from the union
You can call it bullshit, but look it up. It's actually true.

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Originally Posted by da_ticklah View Post
Got a link or something to prove that, sounds like horseshit to me ton's of asian caribbean and european illegals in the West SE and Notheastern US respectively
2002 from the Urban institute was "Countries of origin: Mexicans make up over half of undocumented immigrants—57 percent of the total, or about 5.3 million. Another 2.2 million (23 percent) are from other Latin American countries. About 10 percent are from Asia, 5 percent from Europe and Canada, and 5 percent from the rest of the world." Undocumented Immigrants: Facts and Figures

Plenty more to read at the Center for Immigration Studies, Illegal Immigration | Center for Immigration Studies My more recent figures were from a lecture.

There you can find interesting things like: "Amnesty for illegal immigrants will cause costs to increase significantly from $10.4 billion a year to $28.8 billion. This is because an amnesty program would transform an illegal immigrant to an "unskilled immigrant with legal status" who could access various government programs. However, due to low income, these "unskilled immigrants with legal status" would likely make very modest tax payments." Now add in the fact that people who make low wages pay no taxes and sometimes get refunded more than was taken out of their checks.



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Originally Posted by da_ticklah View Post
this is easy to justify when the manner of illegal being singled out looks nothing like you
That's an easy retort with no substance. The simple fact is that the vast majority of them are hispanic.


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Originally Posted by da_ticklah View Post
I carry ID when I leave my home just cuz black people and the police have a strained relationship at best, and I dont want any to give any young whipper snapper cop reason to act up not because it's the right thing to do. Note how you said if you lived in AZ what do you do in your home state now.
I live in CO, and I don't go anywhere without my driver's license. I have had cops ask to see mt ID before when I wasn't doing anything wrong. Apparently I looked suspicious. I was not traumatized by having to show them my ID.

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I recall the annoyance (eventually used to my advantage) of being racially profiled and followed around stores back home (NYC) in the mid 90's, regardless of dress (urban to business-casual). Have you ever experienced this if not, don't write it off as a non-issue it's wrong and a civil rights violation. Not to the illegal but to the legal hispanics that will be violated by this.
Nope. In the mid-90s I was living in an area of Memphis called Orange Mound where I was the minority.

I'm not saying or implying that prejudices do not exist. We all form Gestalts based on that first view, and all the assigned characteristics come from previous experiences with people who look like the subject or stereotypes we've learned. I've seen racism alive and well in every race and against every other race.

None of that does anything to solve the problems of illegal immigration.

"A 1997 study by the American Academy of Sciences found that the cheap labor of illegal immigrants and poor immigrants caused a 44% decrease in wages among the poorest Americans from 1980 to 1994."
(Center for Immigration Studies). Ignoring problems of illegal immigration leads to exploitation | Center for Immigration Studies

" Illegal immigrants collectively represent a group that is a significant menace to the public. 80% have committed serious crimes in addition to immigration violations, and 40% have violent crime histories."
(Center for Immigration Studies). Taking Back the Streets: ICE and Local Law Enforcement Target Immigrant Gangs | Center for Immigration Studies

Now, I admit that part of that 80% is felony identity theft (part of being here illegally to work), but the 40% with violent crime histories should not be here.
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Old 04-26-2010, 07:39 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Nope. In the mid-90s I was living in an area of Memphis called Orange Mound where I was the minority.

white guy in the mound balls to u sir I've gotta let that 1 marinate... where abouts in the mound I'm in East Memphis myself
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Old 04-26-2010, 07:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm not sure why Arizonians are so eager to get rid of illegal immigrants. Maybe they don't like having a produce section.
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Old 04-26-2010, 08:11 PM   #14 (permalink)
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You can call it bullshit, but look it up. It's actually true.



2002 from the Urban institute was "Countries of origin: Mexicans make up over half of undocumented immigrants—57 percent of the total, or about 5.3 million. Another 2.2 million (23 percent) are from other Latin American countries. About 10 percent are from Asia, 5 percent from Europe and Canada, and 5 percent from the rest of the world." Undocumented Immigrants: Facts and Figures

Plenty more to read at the Center for Immigration Studies, Illegal Immigration | Center for Immigration Studies My more recent figures were from a lecture.

There you can find interesting things like: "Amnesty for illegal immigrants will cause costs to increase significantly from $10.4 billion a year to $28.8 billion. This is because an amnesty program would transform an illegal immigrant to an "unskilled immigrant with legal status" who could access various government programs. However, due to low income, these "unskilled immigrants with legal status" would likely make very modest tax payments." Now add in the fact that people who make low wages pay no taxes and sometimes get refunded more than was taken out of their checks.



That's an easy retort with no substance. The simple fact is that the vast majority of them are hispanic.
Easy but true the 4 horsemen of the right wing apocalypse (Beck, Hannity, ORielly & Limbaugh) would be all over any federal attempt to make white people produce documentation on a whim of any cop Tea party member would be chanting give me liberty or give me death. The simple truth is this is acceptable because it brown people and not white people.


Add in the historical racism of Arizona (resisting a National King Holiday) until the late 90's or 2000 and I'm not at all suprised.
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I live in CO, and I don't go anywhere without my driver's license. I have had cops ask to see mt ID before when I wasn't doing anything wrong. Apparently I looked suspicious. I was not traumatized by having to show them my ID.
Have you had a cop stop you at the corner of you block insisting that you & your vehicle fit the description of a crime that occurred miles away whilst your car is still cool to the touch. Then suggest that things go better for you if you let him search your car, All you your parents and all your neighbors can do is watch and shake their heads. Some are mad at obvious profiling some wonder if I've done something wrong.
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Nope. In the mid-90s I was living in an area of Memphis called Orange Mound where I was the minority.

I'm not saying or implying that prejudices do not exist. We all form Gestalts based on that first view, and all the assigned characteristics come from previous experiences with people who look like the subject or stereotypes we've learned. I've seen racism alive and well in every race and against every other race.

None of that does anything to solve the problems of illegal immigration.
if we want to stop it we'd prosecute the people who employ them, give them no way to make $ and there is no reason to come here.
Quote:
"A 1997 study by the American Academy of Sciences found that the cheap labor of illegal immigrants and poor immigrants caused a 44% decrease in wages among the poorest Americans from 1980 to 1994."
(Center for Immigration Studies). Ignoring problems of illegal immigration leads to exploitation | Center for Immigration Studies

" Illegal immigrants collectively represent a group that is a significant menace to the public. 80% have committed serious crimes in addition to immigration violations, and 40% have violent crime histories."
(Center for Immigration Studies). Taking Back the Streets: ICE and Local Law Enforcement Target Immigrant Gangs | Center for Immigration Studies

Now, I admit that part of that 80% is felony identity theft (part of being here illegally to work), but the 40% with violent crime histories should not be here.
ok so you got a link so noted.
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Old 04-26-2010, 08:16 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by da_ticklah View Post
white guy in the mound balls to u sir I've gotta let that 1 marinate... where abouts in the mound I'm in East Memphis myself
Damn man, going to make me dig back in my brain 15 years. Does Rutland Rd. sound right? After that, I moved near my work, which was right next to the overpass on Jackson Ave and Chelsea. Not exactly a huge step up, lol.
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Old 04-26-2010, 08:21 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Damn man, going to make me dig back in my brain 15 years. Does Rutland Rd. sound right? After that, I moved near my work, which was right next to the overpass on Jackson Ave and Chelsea. Not exactly a huge step up, lol.
no fucking clue, you say rutland Rd. and I think Brooklyn, Jackson and Chelsea not to good either that area is loaded with Hispanics of varying legal status now, ironically enough
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:27 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Yeah, had a lot back when I lived there, too. Everyone was pretty cool with me (except the nation of islam guy that said all white people are devils and tried to stab me, haha). I could walk around at 2am and some mexican guy would offer to share a joint.

My friends from other parts of the city didn't come visit often though. A couple guys came to pick me up and I was talking to this girl Yolanda, and this guy we know from across the street walks out, shoots a shot in the air and yells, "Hey Yolanada, what are all the white boys doing here?" We laughed because we knew he was playing around, but my friends were ducked behind the car going, "oh shit, we're gonna die."

By the time I left, I think you had a 4 way gang war going on. Crips, Bloods, Gangster Disciples, and Vice Lords. I can't imagine it got any better when the latin gangs like MS 13 moved in.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:34 PM   #18 (permalink)
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The bill specifically states that you cant stop or question people based on race. If someone is doing something suspicious or illegal they will now be able to arrest them if they are illegal.
Define suspicious.

If two people are speaking spanish should I be suspicious they are illegals and call the police to check them out? I should assume everyone wearing the "Kiss Me I'm Irish" shirts on St Paddys day are illegal immigrants too, it's suspicious.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:53 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Yeah, had a lot back when I lived there, too. Everyone was pretty cool with me (except the nation of islam guy that said all white people are devils and tried to stab me, haha). I could walk around at 2am and some mexican guy would offer to share a joint.

My friends from other parts of the city didn't come visit often though. A couple guys came to pick me up and I was talking to this girl Yolanda, and this guy we know from across the street walks out, shoots a shot in the air and yells, "Hey Yolanada, what are all the white boys doing here?" We laughed because we knew he was playing around, but my friends were ducked behind the car going, "oh shit, we're gonna die."

By the time I left, I think you had a 4 way gang war going on. Crips, Bloods, Gangster Disciples, and Vice Lords. I can't imagine it got any better when the latin gangs like MS 13 moved in.
re NOI those guys are a bit batshit crazy well intentioned and they do clean up a few ex cons and folks headed down the wrong path but their politics are all fucked up.

Yeah but we've gone from #2 to #5 on the most dangerous city list. More so than I think in most of NYC the gang crime stays in certain parts of the city, near me it's all residential break-in's for jewelry and flat screen TV's, shop lifting and domestic violence.
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Old 04-26-2010, 10:02 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Define suspicious.

If two people are speaking spanish should I be suspicious they are illegals and call the police to check them out? I should assume everyone wearing the "Kiss Me I'm Irish" shirts on St Paddys day are illegal immigrants too, it's suspicious.
Don't be asinine.
Unless the bill specifically changes what is considered reasonable suspicion, then it's the same rules as before.
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