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-   -   2162: Kissing & Screaming (http://www.keithandthegirl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19224)

EthanK 04-13-2015 04:25 PM

Matching weight classes does NOT make anything fair. There is a significant gap in strength between males and females even compared pound for pound: WHSPA State Records - WHSPA here's a sample of highschool state records in my old stomping ground of Wisconsin(I'm using this because it's a pretty straightforward chart with male/female weight classes, apologies if it seems arbitrary), at no weight class do females have the same totals though they generally keep up with deadlift/squat, bench and is always notably lower in the same weight classes across gender. Regardless of whether she's taking hormones now, 30 years of natural male hormones surely had some impact on her body.

Overall I think she probably has an advantage, but for what it's worth she has only fought amateur fighters with poor records. Personally I have more of a problem with wrestlers that have no legs. Sure they don't have legs but if someone is 160 lbs without legs- and legs make up about 40% of your body weight that means he has the torso build of a 250+ pound man- not to mention whatever superhuman wheelchair strength they have from scooting around all day.

Lanfear 04-13-2015 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghauck (Post 841835)

Let's say a male had a leg injury and received a robotic replacement that allowed him to consistently jump 10% further than anyone else in the Olympics. He of course would not be allowed to compete with regular body males and nobody would think this an attack or segregation based on anything other than fair competition. He is still 100% a male in mind and thought. Just not body.

There actually is a German guy who is missing one leg below the knee and tried to sue his way into competing in regular competitions for sprinting and long jump. They did some test and found he had an unfair advantage because of course he has.

rodimusprime 04-13-2015 05:02 PM

I love Jackie The Jokeman. I hope he never stops calling. Like if he dies I hope they've already recorded bits that they can play in the middle of the show like an advertisement.

Lanfear 04-13-2015 05:07 PM

I don't know where Chemda still finds the energy to get emotionally involved in these pointless discussions after knowing Keith & how he works his points on the show for so long and I am not sure whether I should find it admirable or silly.

I pity the poor guests that get caught up in these shows.

Eric M 04-13-2015 05:14 PM

I found it shocking that Lauren would've changed his opinion about this, I wish he was there to speak for himself.

Keith 04-13-2015 05:38 PM

The microwave fried his brain.

Lazarou 04-13-2015 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apia (Post 841811)
I really don't enjoy the " joke man", the annoys me and I always try to fast forward. For me, it's really enought of him.:cool::mad:


But the jokes are so fresh and new!!

FredG 04-13-2015 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by invader (Post 841809)
Are there inherent differences in strength between men and women?
Do those inherent differences make it unfair for men and women to compete against each other in strength based competition?
Does hormone therapy that a trans-person goes through erase this previously unfair advantage?

Three simple questions that would solve the debate.

I "like" how you assume a 'yes' to your first question for your second question, and your third question only means anything if there's a positive answer to your second question. So you're only asking ONE question, "Are men and women different?" And yes, they are! But can you see how that one question is too simple to solve this complex problem?

Women have a higher pain tolerance than men, they're more flexible, and they have a lower center of gravity. Those seem like some advantages in an MMA fight between two people of roughly equal size. counteracting bone density and skeletal muscles advantages.

How about these three questions to determine how you think about it?
1. "Do the strength related benefits of growing up male bodied provide a significant advantage over the toughness related benefits of growing up female bodied?"

2. "Does the situation make sense in reverse?" Would you force a trans man to only fight women once his transition to male was complete? Would you allow a trans man getting into the ring with male fighters?

3. "Are her advantages outside the range of normal genetic drift?" In other words, most men are taller than most women. But I'm a 5ft tall male, and most women are taller than I am.

I'm not considering some hypothetical superman who wanted to transition into a superwoman. I'm talking about this particular female fighter: Was her pre-transition self strong enough that no non-trans woman could possibly catch up?

I think, since Ashlee Evans-Smith won on a TKO (not a decision), that a woman has caught up.

starscream 04-13-2015 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FredG (Post 841870)
I think, since Ashlee Evans-Smith won on a TKO (not a decision), that a woman has caught up.

Having an unfair advantage doesn't equal invulnerability. (Just like invulnerability doesn't equal an unfair advantage.) This whole thing is almost a moot point anyway. Fallon Fox isn't ranked, she's 39, and she will probably never fight for a title again.

Scumhook 04-13-2015 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apia (Post 841811)
I really don't enjoy the " joke man", the annoys me and I always try to fast forward. For me, it's really enought of him.:cool::mad:

How can you not laugh at two bananas talking to a turd????

Oh that's right, you're German...


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