"Slaves Obey Your Masters"

[Cretaceous Bob]

Having rules for the treatment of slaves is inherently advocating slavery. You know why we don't have rules for how you can or can't treat slaves? Because you're not fucking supposed to have slaves.

YOU are also taking things out of context, rabbit. The Bible is, within it's own context, the word of God. No parts of the Old Testament are not the word of God. They are included because they are the word of God. The New Testament is never a rejection of anything in the Old Testament, because the Old Testament is the word of God.

It is not a passage of a guy's opinion OR a passage written by a guy a long time ago with an outdated perspective, considered in the context of the Bible's mythology, which is what we are talking about. It is the divinely ordained order, which includes slavery.

Also the part you reference quickly where Moses and the Israelites are told to keep female child captives for themselves is pretty clearly slavery directly approved by God, so this mental gymnastic you're doing is very silly.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

Having rules for the treatment of slaves is inherently advocating slavery. You know why we don't have rules for how you can or can't treat slaves? Because you're not fucking supposed to have slaves.
.

yeah. we know that /now/. you can't paint history with your modern brush if you want to understand the broader message, to pull from it usable truth. seek the good, man.

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
-Aristotle

[Cretaceous Bob]

He is talking about Christianity as a religion, not as an outdated code that can be transliterated into modern messages by keeping in mind realities that were in force in the time it was written.

They are two very separate things. The things you distill from the Bible viewing it your way have nothing to do with the internal logic and rules of the religion of Christianity. They are two distinctly different ways of reading something, and talking about Christianity as a religion is to exclude the way you look at it.

Christianity is not a religion based around picking and choosing some outdated messages to extrapolate and translate into modern ones from a text that, if taken at face value, is immoral and inconsistent with the modern human conscience. Any religion that does that is not what has been called Christianity for hundreds of years and is fundamentally incompatible with it.

The two cannot be reconciled, and it isn't my mind that has caused that.

[Sparrow]

who said we were debating the latter? that's a circular piece of shit argument that degrades as it goes nowhere. the things we can distill using the bible and our modern brains and sensibilities is a much richer place to be, yeah?

[Cretaceous Bob]

Uh, rabbit did. He talked about Christianity as a religion and I addressed it in that context.

There's nothing circular about it. What you are talking about is not Christianity, and the original post was about Christianity.

[Cretaceous Bob]

Also, yes, obviously pulling what good you can from the Bible and discarding the rest is a better place to be. Christianity is in opposition to that and is the opposite of that and I am not the one causing it to exist.

[Ranz]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

i don't know, man. there /were/ slaves then. there've been slaves throughout all times. there are slaves now.

That is absolute nonsense. There was murder. There was theft. There was all the stuff that a morally upright person would consider wrong. The bible was clear in calling these out as sins, yet conveniently left out slavery as something a christian should find abhorrent.

Furthermore, if this is believed by people as the word from a holy god, you cannot look it at it as in context of the times. It must be always valid, or it is not valid at all.

[Cretaceous Bob]

Double also: there are very sparse good messages in the Bible even viewing picking and choosing as much as you like. Thomas Jefferson, a notorious slave holder and generally shitty guy, even had to toss out almost the whole thing just to try to make some good out of it. The mind's time is probably better spent gleaning better messages from texts not so chock full of bad messages.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

The mind's time is probably better spent gleaning better messages from texts not so chock full of bad messages.

what are your picks, bobby? : )

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Ranz

Furthermore, if this is believed by people as the word from a holy god, you cannot look it at it as in context of the times. It must be always valid, or it is not valid at all.

oh tish tosh. you totally can. women are no longer property (in America) and largely we can take full religious agency in the here and now. that women be silent stuff has changed largely and christianity is still valid.

the whole kibosh, that word of god, changes as we change. always has.