1379: Osama bin Laden is Dead

[Medium Brumski]

Originally Posted by myq

1) i would never answer "why are you vegan" with "it's healthier."

Originally Posted by myq

and the reason our friend jamie kilstein can say "healthy" and have it make sense, is because people generally DO have the sense that it is healthier, and while it need not be in THEORY, in certainly is in practice, as i have just proven/speculated above.

So how come your friend does?

[myq]

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

So how come your friend does?

For reasons that I believe I covered already-- that although there is nothing about the vegan diet specifically that is necessarily or definitively healthier than a thoughtful omnivorous one, the fact remains that in PRACTICE, there are proportionately more healthy vegans than healthy omnivores, which leads to a reasonable societal stereotype of vegans as healthy, despite the technical lack of a direct causality of vegan-->health relationship.

That is to say, people in general have a sense of veganism as healthy, which it needn't be in theory but IS most of the time in practice (usually because the average vegan DOES put more thought into diet than the average/unhealthy omnivore, because it is necessary to do so).

Obviously if someone who was NOT thoughtful became vegan because they thought it automatically/magically MADE them healthier, that would be stupid and wrong. And I'm not saying some people don't do that. But my assessment is that MOST people who become vegan don't. Most people who do become vegan put in more thought to their diet than most people who are omnivores. That's why most vegans are healthier than most omnivores. And that's why it makes sense for people to THINK of veganism as healthier, and why it makes sense for someone to say health and veganism are connected (again, not be direct causation alone, but in concert with these other facts and reasons).

[dEadERest]

conjecture much?

[Junkenstein]

Originally Posted by Medium Brumski

So how come your friend does?

theres some elements in meat that are damaging to the human organism and arent present in vegetables, where most of the nutritional aspects of meat can be found in vegan equicalents.

Vegans i know seem healthier, considering that they also couple veganism with other healthy lifestyle choices (no smoking, no excessive booze, no weird pharamaceuticals). just a pattern i noticed.

i have a series of mental blocks and quirks about my personality that make me becoming a vegan really difficult, but i see it as a perfectly logical choice.

[myq]

Originally Posted by dEadERest

conjecture much?

Which part do you disagree with?
Do you know a lot of out-of-shape, unhealthy vegans?
I have traveled the country, eaten in dozens of vegetarian restaurants, and seen people who don't.

While I don't know the exact obesity rate of vegans, I feel comfortable in "conjecturing" that it's much lower than the obesity rate in the population at large, most of which not vegan.

So yes, sometimes I make reasonable conjectures based on real life experience and rationality. That's sort of part of being a human.

You?

[Loki74]

Myq is that you?

[myq]

Originally Posted by Loki74

Myq is that you?

I don't know. I don't have permission to view that image.

[Blitzgal]

Originally Posted by myq

Do you know a lot of out-of-shape, unhealthy vegans?

Yes. But I'm in Wisconsin, so that may skew the stats, because most people here are fat. But yes, I know two vegans and both are overweight. You can stuff yourself with simple starches like rice and potatoes and get fat. It's the same thing that happens in impoverished areas of Asia/Pacific Islands where rice is the bulk staple of their diet because they can't afford meat or fish.

Balance and moderation appear to be far more important. And there are certainly class based issues at hand in this country. Shit food is cheaper.

[myq]

Originally Posted by myq

Do you know a lot of out-of-shape, unhealthy vegans?

Originally Posted by Blitzgal

Yes, I know two vegans and both are overweight.

I wouldn't say that two is a lot. (Understanding of course that if those are the only vegans you're familiar with, then 2 out of 2 is technically a high percentage. But you know me and MC Mr. Napkins, so that should decrease it to 50% at most. Unless we're the ones you're calling fat. In which case, you're mean and I'm going out running.)

The first two vegans I met were actually fat as well. I never said it didn't or couldn't happen. But the majority of vegans I've met are not. And the majority of Americans are. I know tons of skinny vegans (which takes a lot of vegans), but I know even more tons of fat non-vegans.

Is anyone disputing any of these assessments:
1) The majority of Americans* are unhealthy. (The obesity rate is verifiable.)
2) The majority of American vegans are not unhealthy.


* I could go worldwide with this too, I believe, when you throw in starvation and such... unless you count starving people as vegan because they're technically not eating any meat (or any thing). That could certainly skew the results out of my favor. But let's keep the sample size smaller and complications down if possible.

[Loki74]

Originally Posted by myq

I don't know. I don't have permission to view that image.

From your mom?