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Old 04-30-2008, 10:18 AM   #21 (permalink)
Wit
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Malcolm, want to elaborate further? The status quo is to not even discuss Lincoln's questionable actions. Why wasn't the suspension a necessity? Mind you, I'm sure we're both in agreement that it definitely isn't necessary in today's world though.

Besides, Neely won the Pulitzer Prize for a work on Lincoln and Civil Liberties so I'll trust him for now...
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Old 04-30-2008, 10:23 AM   #22 (permalink)
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For Fuck sake

Man we do love to run out like an uninformed lynch mob and string up the first group that we can get our hands on!

Fuckin President is causing the Gas prices to go up!

Nah it's the congress!

IT'S those bastards at those big oil companies, look how much money they are making! (ignore the fact that they are supplying the product with the highest demand on the entire globe at single digit profit margins)


Look if you guys want to run out and string someone up because it now cost you $30 to gas up your fucking hybrid roller skate car. I'll tell you exactly who your looking for

First you what to run down to NYC and get all those fucking Oil Speculators (you know the guys who buy up the oil from the oil companies that pull it out of the ground) if you want to fix these douche bags have regulators install a requirement that they buy up the oil contracts with at least 40% cash rather than using 100% credit to buy up everything they can, basically gambling without putting any cash out. If these guys had to come up with some cash of their own to gamble with you would see the price drop overnight.

second you want to swing by and jack up that Ben guy over at the Federal Reserve, get him to stop lowering the Fed Prime rate which is driving down the value of the dollar! oil prices in the EU have risen about 90% where they have gone up near 200% because the dollar continues to drop like a stone!
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Old 04-30-2008, 10:50 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Beefmon, your comments concerning oil and Bush are very informed. But I'm a little concerned about your view of climate change. Do you deny it entirely? There is scientific consensus about the damn issue. Even if it somehow isn't real - What harm is there in creating sustainable energy policies?
Is the climate changing? Yes
Is it man made? No

Weather patterns are cyclical. You have periods of hotter summers and colder winters and cooler summers and warmer winters. Go back and graph the avg temp for the last 125 years. It kinda looks like a sine wave. Hell I remember in grade school people were calling for the next ice age.
On July 24, 1974 Time Magazine published an article entitled "Another Ice Age?" Here's the first paragraph:

"As they review the bizarre and unpredictable weather pattern of the past several years, a growing number of scientists are beginning to suspect that many seemingly contradictory meteorological fluctuations are actually part of a global climatic upheaval. However widely the weather varies from place to place and time to time, when meteorologists take an average of temperatures around the globe they find that the atmosphere has been growing gradually cooler for the past three decades. The trend shows no indication of reversing. Climatological Cassandras are becoming increasingly apprehensive, for the weather aberrations they are studying may be the harbinger of another ice age."
BTW, look into where people are getting their temperature data. You might be surprised that thermometers are place in some plenty silly places to gather that data.

http://surfacestations.org/odd_sites.htm
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:06 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Demand is down over the past 10 months according to the industry info publisher, on the Marketplace program

Single-digit profit margins are common in many many businesses.
Really? Are you taking into the entire world's demand. Have you looked into China's sharp increase of fuel? We are buying gas and competing with the entire world for what is available.
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Do you know the difference between profits and profit margins.? Lets imagine a 1% profit margin on $1billion in revenue. At 1% profit margin, the profit is $10million. When prices triple, the $1billion becomes $3billion. When they maintain margins the profit becomes $30million. I've actually heard the oil companies justify current retail gas prices by saying that their margins have not changed. They really are maintaining the margins, and their profit is in parody with the prices.
Capitalism is the cure for liberalism. You just can't stand someone to work hard, provide a product and actually get paid for their effort can you?


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No small operator is going to just build a multi-billion dollar refinery and put them out of business tomorrow.

Huh? Congress will not approve the building of new refineries. That is the whole problem. Congress will not let us drill or build new facilities to refine oil. Do you read much or do you just listen and go "baaaaaaa"
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:19 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Wit View Post
Malcolm, want to elaborate further? The status quo is to not even discuss Lincoln's questionable actions. Why wasn't the suspension a necessity? Mind you, I'm sure we're both in agreement that it definitely isn't necessary in today's world though.

Besides, Neely won the Pulitzer Prize for a work on Lincoln and Civil Liberties so I'll trust him for now...
I don't care if he won a Pulitzer Prize, and Oscar, and a lifetime supply of Cheese Whiz... that entire war was unnecessary, and we're still paying for it today. There were plenty of alternatives to war between the North and South. They weren't taken. We all lost. Man, you've got to get outside of the boxcar of conventional U.S. history that our educational systems have been rolling on down the track. Boring.
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:21 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Who exactly do you think is preventing G.W., Cheney and Big Oil from drilling in ANWR and building more refineries... Ed Begley Jr., Al Gore, Johnny Appleseed? This is one of the biggest myths ever perpetrated on the American people. What a joke. Is it PETA, Greenpeace, Ralph Nader? Oooh, we know how powerful Nader is. Environmentalists aren't organized. They don't have any power in Washington. Again I say, give me a break. Oil companies... Waaaa. No won will let widdle baby oil company dwill... Waaaa. If they wanted to drill there, you're milkshake would already be drunk.
Let me just take a wild guess and say it is Congress not approving the building of refineries.

BTW, liberals organizations ARE organized. Do a little reading on MoveOn.org, DailyKos.com and a little organization called Mediamatters.org. They are heavily funded and they are DEEP in the pockets of politicians. Follow the money and you will see. These are the folks that are driving policy in Washington along with Congressmen looking to pander to their constituents.

Take a look at contributions made to Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi, John Murtha, and Pete Stark.

Last edited by beefmon; 04-30-2008 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:46 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Let me just take a wild guess and say it is Congress not approving the building of refineries.

BTW, liberals organizations ARE organized. Do a little reading on MoveOn.org, DailyKos.com and a little organization called aft.org. They are heavily funded and they are DEEP in the pockets of politicians. Follow the money and you will see. These are the folks that are driving policy in Washington along with Congressmen looking to pander to their constituents.

Take a look at contributions made to Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi, John Murtha, and Pete Stark.
Could Bush issue an executive order? Yes. Would we impeach him? No. End of story.

I guess we need to get you a new bogeyman. Hmm... I'll work on that.
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:46 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Take a look at this map. That little red box is the area they want to drill in ANWR.

"OMG, their going to destroy ANWR!"

Give me a break
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:47 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jeffdrafttech View Post
Demand is down over the past 10 months according to the industry info publisher, on the Marketplace program
President Bush: One of the main reasons for high gas prices is that global oil production is not keeping up with growing demand.

Barbara Shook: The U.S. market is well supplied. Do you see anybody waiting in line at the filling station?



President Bush: Another reason for the high gas prices is the lack of refining capacity. It's been more than 30 years since America built its last new refinery.

Barbara Shook: We're expanding refining capacity in this country. We have probably more than half a million barrels of new refining capacity per day under construction right now and I wouldn't be surprised to see another 100,000 barrels per day of new capacity announced in the next six months to a year.



im not sure why you listed that as something backing up your argument when it backed what the president said 100%. i question your ability to see through obvious spin...

how do you feel about the obvious spin here? zero mention of china and india bidding up the prices as their demand for energy goes up...

would you support a ban on burning oil, and coal for that matter, for energy(except portable fuels)? and support making america 100% nuclear?
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To be fair, to really follow Spooky's diet, you can't just eat chicken. You have to spend your days cleaning up after a slob roommate and night shivering like a rain soaked rage filled chihuahua about having to clean up after said roommate until you finally snap and yell at him. It should be called the Mexican maid diet.

Last edited by spooky; 04-30-2008 at 01:15 PM.
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Old 04-30-2008, 12:25 PM   #30 (permalink)
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heres a thought

what if we upped the prices of gas in america a dollar at the pump, took 100% of that dollar, and used it to cut the prices of diesel, making the bottom line for transportation costs for goods go down.

wouldnt that lower costs overall for lower income families, sure, they pay more at the pump, but groceries and clothes and everything else they use becomes cheaper, and since its a larger portion of lower income earners budget, they benefit more.

obviously, this assumes a brokered deal with companies involved that ensures they contractually pass the savings directly on to the consumer, and you have to assume there wouldnt be corruption, which there always is, no matter your party affiliation.

this would never happen, of course, because the democrats would find an old lady somewhere who would suffer, because she drives, but maybe she has her meals covered at work or something, thus republicans are evil. but just for a minute, i wonder what would happen?
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