1471: Ted's American Dream?

[DJ Trashy]

Originally Posted by FletchLives

I see why we are at a misunderstanding. I took it as a given that everyone knew the coporations owned our government. Congress has the power to change the laws that fuck us over and reward heartless capitalism. But why would heartless capitalists vote to end heartless capitalism?

No, everyone does NOT know that, otherwise the Tea Party wouldn't exist *heh* - but yes, ME - I've known that for awhile now. I still think it is good to have protesters out there even if it might not cause any major shifts. I mean hey, they're unemployed - what else the hell they gonna do? LOL

Originally Posted by FletchLives

You want to raise the taxes on the corporations? Ok, you end up having ALL corporations follow Exxon Mobil's example and just not pay shit. Well now we're trillions more in deficit, and there's not a goddamn thing the government or the people can do about it.
Take off your idealistic goggles. You have to factor in how evil people are.

Depending on whom you read, Exxon pays billions in taxes each year, most of it overseas. But then articles like this one indicate that 'effective' tax rates are at all-time lows. That is what drives the protest, but I have no idealism to shed. I've never thought the OWS would achieve any lasting change. I do, however, like having it out in public, and I hope it at least pisses off a few people.

[FletchLives]

Originally Posted by DJ Trashy

No, everyone does NOT know that, otherwise the Tea Party wouldn't exist *heh* - but yes, ME - I've known that for awhile now. I still think it is good to have protesters out there even if it might not cause any major shifts. I mean hey, they're unemployed - what else the hell they gonna do? LOL



Depending on whom you read, Exxon pays billions in taxes each year, most of it overseas. But then articles like this one indicate that 'effective' tax rates are at all-time lows. That is what drives the protest, but I have no idealism to shed. I've never thought the OWS would achieve any lasting change. I do, however, like having it out in public, and I hope it at least pisses off a few people.

Woah. Did we just come to a semi-agreement?

[DJ Trashy]

fuck this

[PsychoLoco]

DJ Trashy, you keep coming back to taxes and the amounts held offshore, etc. Is it not logical for a company that can save money in any way to do so? It is, everyone does it. If you want to fix this problem, the best solution is to make our system the tax haven, which means lowering taxes to attract a larger base. What everyone is advocating is that these companies and wealthy individuals should pay more, the exact opposite of what should be done.

***I'm making the following numbers up, but they do reflect Ukrainian/Cypriot tax rates***

Offshore = 10% tax rate
US = 35% tax rate
Result = Offshore government gets 10% of US company taxes funneled through offshore companies. (Tax-optimized companies in Ukraine have offshore companies that hold 100% of the stock to minimize payments to the host government because the amount of taxes is high and their use is not always transparent.)

The alternative is to change our tax rate to 9.99% and get all of those offshore taxes. There will continue to be a downward spiral of tax revenues to the government as long as taxes are continually increased.

Texas is a good example of a balanced tax system. There is a flat sales tax that applies to everyone equally and exempts necessary items (like basic foods). There is no income tax and a 0.5%-1.0% franchise tax rate depending on your total revenues. There is also a property tax. Texas has problems with its budget because of its spending decisions, not because of its ability to collect revenue.

[FletchLives]

To be honest guys, I'm not sympathetic to the 1%. I just knew no one would be on that side of fence, which would make it no fun to discuss.
"Hey I like what these guys are doing."
"Yeah, man."
See? Boring
I do believe that nothing will be accomplished by the OWS movement. And I agree that Texas has done fairly well. We, Dallas specifically, were the least affected by the recession. We would be doing fucking amazing if Rick Perry had created jobs for us. But instead, he created hundreds of thousands of jobs for illegals. Which, in turn, spawns more illegals.

[PsychoLoco]

Originally Posted by FletchLives

To be honest guys, I'm not sympathetic to the 1%. I just knew no one would be on that side of fence, which would make it no fun to discuss.
"Hey I like what these guys are doing."
"Yeah, man."
See? Boring
I do believe that nothing will be accomplished by the OWS movement. And I agree that Texas has done fairly well. We, Dallas specifically, were the least affected by the recession. We would be doing fucking amazing if Rick Perry had created jobs for us. But instead, he created hundreds of thousands of jobs for illegals. Which, in turn, spawns more illegals.

Imagine how much worse it would have been in Texas if we didn't have all the illegals and otherwise illegally employed individuals (drug dealers, cash-only, etc.) paying sales tax. That's another plus for a consumption tax. As an accountant, I can manipulate income.

[FletchLives]

Originally Posted by PsychoLoco

Imagine how much worse it would have been in Texas if we didn't have all the illegals and otherwise illegally employed individuals (drug dealers, cash-only, etc.) paying sales tax. That's another plus for a consumption tax. As an accountant, I can manipulate income.

I'm not a southern deportationist (that will become a word sooner or later) or completely against illegals. I just think it's misrepresentation when Perry boasts all the jobs he created, when 81% (fact check that, I may be off by a bit) of the jobs he created were for illegal immigrants. Yes, the cash flow would have been worse in Texas, but it would have been a lot better for our country's economy if those newly created jobs were paying taxes.

[stulagu]

Originally Posted by FletchLives

I'm not a southern deportationist (that will become a word sooner or later) or completely against illegals. I just think it's misrepresentation when Perry boasts all the jobs he created, when 81% (fact check that, I may be off by a bit) of the jobs he created were for illegal immigrants. Yes, the cash flow would have been worse in Texas, but it would have been a lot better for our country's economy if those newly created jobs were paying taxes.

I love the word deportionist...go TM it!

I have family in Texas and have gotten the lowdown on Perry as well. In order to not raise taxes he has cut back on government spending...like getting rid of the national guard so when it was time to put out those fires, no one was equipt to do so...and they got out of control. The school system sucks, too. I don't care how little taxes they pay, there is no way I'd want to have my country run like Texas.

Except for Austin, that is a little breath of reality in the center of crazyland.

[FletchLives]

Originally Posted by stulagu

I love the word deportionist...go TM it!

I have family in Texas and have gotten the lowdown on Perry as well. In order to not raise taxes he has cut back on government spending...like getting rid of the national guard so when it was time to put out those fires, no one was equipt to do so...and they got out of control. The school system sucks, too. I don't care how little taxes they pay, there is no way I'd want to have my country run like Texas.

Except for Austin, that is a little breath of reality in the center of crazyland.

Exactly. Rick Perry created a ton of jobs for illegals... by laying off thousands of teachers and various civil servants. I don't know if the news made it national, but there were volunteer firemen who wanted help put out the wildfires, some of whom drove up to 8 hours, and they were turned away. they were turned away because Texas did not want to splurge on the gear and insurance for the firemen to save hundreds of acres and her resident's homes.

[stulagu]

Originally Posted by FletchLives

Exactly. Rick Perry created a ton of jobs for illegals... by laying off thousands of teachers and various civil servants. I don't know if the news made it national, but there were volunteer firemen who wanted help put out the wildfires, some of whom drove up to 8 hours, and they were turned away. they were turned away because Texas did not want to splurge on the gear and insurance for the firemen to save hundreds of acres and her resident's homes.

When I went to the Texas History Museum, they had a movie on how Texas won the civil war, Texas put the first person on the moon, etc. etc. It was the weirdest thing I've ever seen.

I still hold to my belief that within the next 100 years, Texas will try to succeed from the union.