1924: Think of the Children

[Keith]

Un-described "molesting" he'll debate. But you're gonna tell him semen could have been involved? That's laughable!

HA HA HA!

No one can know what truly happened, except for the fact that Woody definitely did not produce ejaculate. That's preposterous.

Also totally not on one side or the other. We just need to get real when it comes to sperm leaving the body.

[mollyfud]

Originally Posted by Grampoo

Check that nude pics of Soon-Yi at 15 years old "fact" specifically. Chemda, that one really hurt your case in my opinion and you didn't double-check it when Pat called it into doubt, but kinda doubled down and sighted it over and over as fact.

I don't know if it hurts Keith and Chemda's argument as much as it makes Pat's main argument that things that aren't (necessarily) facts are being represented as facts. I go back to my point yesterday that I don't know what happened in the Dylan/Woody issue and I only know a little more about the Soon Yi/Woody issue and the points on it are still slightly murky as well (i.e. it seems conflicting stories on how much they had to do with each other as Soon Yi grew up with comments like (parphasing) "Mia asked Woody give Soon Yi some time around when she was 16". If I had to comment on there relationship, yes its a creepy start but the fact they are married 20 odd years seems a lot better relationship then many in Hollywood.

But back to the Photo. It seems funny to me that anti-Woody stories wouldn't mention that the photos were of a 15 year old Soon Yi when they mention the photos. Pro-Woody sites I could expect to not mention it, but not anti sites. Surely it would be the first thing that they mention even its just that there was controversy about the age at time of the photo if it isn't 100% proven and they don't want to get sued. So again, like Pat, I would like to know if there is a credible source/link that mentions the 15 year old age point about the photo? I would like to know to have that side of the story.

JMTC

PS. Keith - as asked for, I'm an E not a C

PS. PS. Again, from yesterday. Haven't seen a full Woody movie as the bore me to tears.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Sakugenken

Basically it is a fact that a middle-aged man went after the 15 daughter of his girlfriend. That is sick in most anyone's book.

not commenting on woody allen or advocating acting on inappropriate sexual impulses, but

it's a common fantasy; i've made rent playing out that fantasy with people. there are full sites dedicated to "the girlfriend's daughter" meme. there's little hotter than 15 year old pussy. had one. can confirm. girls like to fantasize about being raped, doesn't mean they're out to get themselves raped. humans are gross meat machines; power, and there are a variety of those, over others gets us real sexual.

you're also assuming young girls can't be predatory as well in these exchanges. i sure as hell was. i looked 12 until i was 20; i knew what that did to men and i worked the fuck out of it. i have friends from high school who initiated make outs with teachers. we were hungry girls. we had the power. 15 year old pussy, man.

again, no comments on its rightness or wrongness, just its prevalence and, maybe not normalcy, but it's certainly on the run-of-the-mill, if only less spoken, vanilla side of deviancy.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by mollyfud

The Soon Yi/Woody issue: the points on it are still slightly murky.

Woody met Soon Yi when she was 7-years-old and was a father figure to her throughout her life as he was with Mia Farrow (for a total of 12 years). When Woody married Soon Yi, who he saw grow up from a 7-year-old to a 19-year-old, he was 56-years-old.

He admits he likes the paternal feeling he has over Soon Yi.

Now the points are less murky.

You know this is ridiculous. What are you doing?

[Sakugenken]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

it's a common fantasy; i've made rent playing out that fantasy with people. there are full sites dedicated to "the girlfriend's daughter" meme. there's little hotter than 15 year old pussy. had one. can confirm.

Living in Japan, I don't have to be told that. Schoolgirl porn surrounds me!
Yesterday the guy driving in front of me was texting and going about 20 kilometers under the speed limit. At a red light I felt like getting out of my car and killing him. If I had I would be in jail now. Having a fantasy and acting on one are two different things. Woody's wife didn't look 15, she was 15 (and some even say younger).

[mollyfud]

Originally Posted by Keith

Woody met Soon Yi when she was 7-years-old and was a father figure to her throughout her life as he was with Mia Farrow (for a total of 12 years). When Woody married Soon Yi, who he saw grow up from a 7-year-old to a 19-year-old, he was 56-years-old.

He admits he likes the paternal feeling he has over Soon Yi.

Now the points are less murky.

You know this is ridiculous. What are you doing?

So, why do people keep bringing up about Mia asking Woody to do more with her, spend more time with her? I understand the "meet" at 7 but I don't know enough of the interactions between 7 and 16. From those "Spend more time comments" and the fact they never fully integrated lives (i.e. lived apart) that he may have had little to do with each other.

You are right that either way, it is very unsual and a bit creepy.

[Sparrow]

that japanese lolita stuff is nuts. they'll go further pre-pubescent than the average American; may have something to do with our cultural history with breasts. we fucking love tits. more camp counselor and less manga school girl and baby doll. the why's and what's of japanese sexual proclivities is a whole separate conversation to be had. culture! >.<* (please share stories if you have 'em on the topic. i'm interested.)

i agree, acting out the inappropriate is inappropriate. not commenting on woody; that's a whole sack of crazy on top of everything else. just that it's not so out there for a middle aged man to respond sexually to a burgeoning girl.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Keith

He admits he likes the paternal feeling he has over Soon Yi.

go with me for just a second.

can we talk about Soon Yi? not as Woody's hapless victim, but as a person with agency. we've been talking a lot about and for her.

is it so out there to think she likes it, too? were she a willing participant in this would it change the conversation? would we be talking about her culpability in marrying her mother's ex? would we be branding her with a scarlet A for being excited by an older, inappropriate man at 15? if her marriage has a consensual headship structure does that make her character suspect?

she's not a rag doll. she's a person. given she was approved to adopt twice, she's at least not a seriously damaged or deranged individual. what do we know of her experience? has she spoken openly from her side about any of it?

[Keith]

Of course she likes it too. I think we all agree with that. Nothing changes.

[Electric Squirrel]

I don't know what people are talking about that they thought Chemda sounded emotional or angry when she was debating Pat. Truthfully, Chemda was the only person in the debate staying calm.

If Keith and Chemda didn't hold Pat to task on how little he would actually commit to saying I probably would have turned off this episode. But that's why we listen to KATG, because Keith and Chemda aren't going to take bullshit.

And, Yes. Pat did have a different tone when he would respond to Chemda. To me, when Pat would address Keith it sounded like he was talking to an equal. He sounded like he was slowing down his speech like he was talking to a child when he would respond to Chemda.

Pat is still one of my favorite guests but none the less he came off as a dick last episode to be honest.