2040: The Agony and the Ecstasy

[phl8me]

Thanks for posting the video. I heard many "news" reports that were not even close to what was in that video.

As for retraining. Do you think police forces came up with this overnight or have continued to refine the response to this situations after decades of experience?

You are young and naive about this. You will come around eventually.

Edit: I quoted incorrectly. Danny am referring to you. Just to be clear.

[rodimusprime]

I think the shooting was justified. I think the training looked like it was callous and cold but that is what it looks like when your training actually does take over. I have no issue with that shooting and I'd hate to be a cop in that situation.

Some folks sent me the video under the idea that it wasn't justified but I honestly think the cops had to kill that guy or else they were going to risk their own deaths or a bystander. Imagine if that knife guy go a hold of a hostage or a kid or something. Then we'd be asking why the cops didn't kill him when they had the chance.

[backgen]

Was just listening in to this while walking...and i got so pissed listening to the arguments on the shooting that i was practically running by the time the girl called in.

How is this even up for debate! Chemda and Danny are totally 100% right on this one - the guy did not have a gun, was a fair enough distance away from the cops and the cops could have EASILY shot him in his legs to disable him or switch to a non-lethal weapon like mace or taser when they saw he didn't have a gun (hell, even just ONE of them could have switch over...whats the point of travelling in pairs if you don't fkin work together).

instead they shot the guy 6 times EACH. 6 FUCKING SHOTS! Are you kidding me? What is this the fucking wild west? Anyone who's handled a gun will know how insanely powerful just one shot is - if you're pulling the trigger multiple times like that it's BECAUSE YOU'RE PANICKING! The fact that they panicked is not an excuse, they are trained (or should be trained) not to panic in such situations, precisely because it means that someone lives or dies (chemda was totally right on this too).

[Scat]

Originally Posted by backgen

Was just listening in to this while walking...and i got so pissed listening to the arguments on the shooting that i was practically running by the time the girl called in.

How is this even up for debate! Chemda and Danny are totally 100% right on this one - the guy did not have a gun, was a fair enough distance away from the cops and the cops could have EASILY shot him in his legs to disable him or switch to a non-lethal weapon like mace or taser when they saw he didn't have a gun (hell, even just ONE of them could have switch over...whats the point of travelling in pairs if you don't fkin work together).

instead they shot the guy 6 times EACH. 6 FUCKING SHOTS! Are you kidding me? What is this the fucking wild west? Anyone who's handled a gun will know how insanely powerful just one shot is - if you're pulling the trigger multiple times like that it's BECAUSE YOU'RE PANICKING! The fact that they panicked is not an excuse, they are trained (or should be trained) not to panic in such situations, precisely because it means that someone lives or dies (chemda was totally right on this too).

I don't get it, did you read the thread? There are some good posts showing how dangerous a knife can be from that distance. The guy had a knife, and was approaching the cops with it. He wanted to die. You don't shoot a guy in the legs, for all we know he has so much adrenaline running through him that he wouldn't even feel the bullets. Unless you have a gun powerful enough to blow his legs off, that's a stupid decision.

I'll give you this - Maybe if they had parked further away from the guy, they would have had more time to evaluate the situation and switch to a taser.

[rodimusprime]

They should've just talked to the guy with the knife. I'm sure cooler heads would've prevailed given enough time. Maybe if they'd shown up with some hot tea and just sat for a spell. I guess we'll never know.

[bithead]

Originally Posted by Scumhook

If you pull a knife on a cop, you deserve to get shot.

If you wave a gun (toy or not) at a cop, you deserve to get shot.

If you've just knocked over a store, and are walking down the middle of the street like a cunt, you deserve to get shot.

If you litter...

[backgen]

Originally Posted by Scat

I don't get it, did you read the thread? There are some good posts showing how dangerous a knife can be from that distance. The guy had a knife, and was approaching the cops with it. He wanted to die. You don't shoot a guy in the legs, for all we know he has so much adrenaline running through him that he wouldn't even feel the bullets. Unless you have a gun powerful enough to blow his legs off, that's a stupid decision.

I'll give you this - Maybe if they had parked further away from the guy, they would have had more time to evaluate the situation and switch to a taser.

He wanted to die so the cops should oblige him? Euthanasia for all!

I understand the arguments made in the thread justifying what the cops did and i'm saying they're fucking stupid. Just look at the facts - the man was armed with a knife therefore he had to get close to the police officers in order to do harm. They could have backed away when he approached them (the guy was not in extremely close proximity to any civilians so backing away would not have endangered anyone).

They could have fired a warning shot at his feet during his second approach when he was still too far away to strike at either of them.

They could have TRIED to incapacitate him by shooting him in the legs, or at THE VERY LEAST shoot him once or twice in the chest (probably would still have died...but maybe not).

instead they choose to shoot him 6 times EACH. I don't get why no one is picking up on this - doesn't anyone else think that shooting a guy 6 times in the chest is a little overkill? A policeman's goal should NEVER be to kill someone - you incapacitate, that's it. If you're shooting someone 6 times its either because you're panicking or you intend to kill them. Panic is unacceptable for police.

[Scat]

Originally Posted by rodimusprime

They should've just talked to the guy with the knife. I'm sure cooler heads would've prevailed given enough time. Maybe if they'd shown up with some hot tea and just sat for a spell. I guess we'll never know.

I do think immediately yelling at the guy with your gun drawn probably didn't help matters. They might have been able to talk him down with the right approach, but there's so much tension between the cops and people there that maybe not.

[Keith]

I think he made it clear it wasn't up for debate.

[bithead]

I find stepping away from whatever I'm troubleshooting, going on a walk, or otherwise being distracted with something else, gives me clarity of mind. A vacation does this 10 times over. The last thing we need is something heads-down into work 365 days/year for 3 years making important - and often life-changing - decisions affecting millions of people without a clear mind.

Yes, The President of the United States should take vacation.