2090: Your Pad or Mine?

[John Galt]

"I filled my car up with diesel..."

That is a difficult thing to accomplish in most places. Usually the spigot is deliberately made so that it doesn't fit in a gasoline fuel tank fill tube.

[Lanfear]

Originally Posted by jaredv1214

the difference between Big Ben and Pat is that Keith actually has several accounts of Pat's actions. Keith said he needed some facts to make a decision. Why wouldn't he? Liza and Megan just twisted everything Keith was saying and getting angry about what they said Keith said which was different than what Keith actually said. Of course alleged victims need to prove their accusations in court because that's the entire point of our court system. Just because Keith is hesitant to say Ben is guilty because he hasn't seen any proof does not mean he is shaming the victims.

Well lets just decide that I'm a hysterical female then and be done with it.

[Dean from Australia]

Originally Posted by jaredv1214

...Liza and Megan just twisted everything Keith was saying and getting angry about what they said Keith said which was different than what Keith actually said...

Whoa...my eyes are bleeding!!

[Enunciated Piffle]

Amanda Bynes publicly falling apart reminds me of Steve-O's situation, (pre-sobriety). Apparently Johnny Knoxville got increasingly concerned about him. He called his friend Dr Drew and was instructed to 51/50 Steve-O. I guess this is where you can have someone committed to a psych ward for 72 hours when it's clear they're batshit. It literally saved his life.

Dean, you're a woman in the medical field. Do they have 51/50 in Australia?

[Dean from Australia]

Originally Posted by Enunciated Piffle

Dean, you're a woman in the medical field. Do they have 51/50 in Australia?

Haha - Fuck you Piffle

We can detain an individual under Section 23 of the Mental Health Act (of Parliament) for a period of (I think) 72 hours - so it's basically the same thing. It's been a while since I've had to pull the forms (I'm in ICU where we detain people with propofol!) but yeah, in that time, the detained individual has to submit to a psychiatric assessment and satisfy certain criteria in order to be released into the community again.

[jaredv1214]

Originally Posted by Lanfear

Well lets just decide that I'm a hysterical female then and be done with it.

Oh Lanfear, that's not what I'm saying. It's just that, based on what you wrote, it sounded like you were comparing those two situations as if they were the same, when in reality, there are a few key differences. Keith saying he needs evidence to determine guilt shouldn't be shocking or cause for whiplash. In the Pat case, Keith already has evidence in the form of several statements of the victims, in the Big Ben case there is only the out-of-court settlement without any of the facts being disclosed. Like I wrote in on the show, innocent people settle out of court all the time and Liza's accusation that settling out of court means someone is guilty is rather presumptuous and not based in fact.

You are not being hysterical, or anything of the sort, I just wanted to point out the differences that separate the two incidences. Sorry if you felt I was attacking you personally.

[thirteen]

Originally Posted by jaredv1214

the difference between Big Ben and Pat is that Keith actually has several accounts of Pat's actions. Keith said he needed some facts to make a decision. Why wouldn't he? Liza and Megan just twisted everything Keith was saying and getting angry about what they said Keith said which was different than what Keith actually said. Of course alleged victims need to prove their accusations in court because that's the entire point of our court system. Just because Keith is hesitant to say Ben is guilty because he hasn't seen any proof does not mean he is shaming the victims.

The problem is that it's not consistent with previous statements. Since when have the public waited until a case makes its way through court before deciding whether or not a person is guilty? Most people jump to conclusions. The thing is though...its been mentioned on the show many times that the men who play professional football have a very specific type of personality. One that is not above attacking people. That's not to say they're all guilty, but Keith has spoken about them in a negative way on the show before.

I do think it's in poor taste to bring up the fact that video evidence or marks all over someone's body (depending on how much the victim claims they were physically abused) is what you need to believe someone's story. It was fine for Megan and Liza to mention it.

Originally Posted by jaredv1214

...in the Big Ben case there is only the out-of-court settlement without any of the facts being disclosed. Like I wrote in on the show, innocent people settle out of court all the time and Liza's accusation t

There have been at least 3 women who have come forward about it. One took a settlement without recanting her initial accusation.

[jaredv1214]

This isn't about people in general though, it's about Keith's determination. It is completely his prerogative to wait for information, information he has made an open invitation for people to send him, before he makes up his mind.

Again this was part of what Liza, Megan, and, to a lesser extent, even Chemda twisted around. Keith said he needed evidence that proved Ben was guilty. Courts need this to convict so it shouldn't be in poor taste at all. Keith just said it helped him make up his mind a lot faster with the Ray Rice case because there was a video. Liza interrupted him and then twisted his words to say that he claimed that unless there was video evidence the rape didn't count. Keith absolutely didn't say that in any fashion.

Like Keith said, the information is probably out there, but it's not as "in your face" as Ray Rice, AP, or Vick. Keith made an open request for anyone and everyone to send him the information that proves Ben is guilty. Also Just because she didn't recant it, doesn't mean it is necessarily true. It is innocent until proven guilty to protect people from false accusation and help ensure their freedom in the case of innocence.

This isn't a debate on whether or not Ben is innocent, it is about whether Keith has seen any evidence to prove one way or another. People shouldn't say it's poor taste to want evidence of a crime, it's the whole point of our judicial system.

[Dean from Australia]

Originally Posted by jaredv1214

This isn't a debate on whether or not Ben is innocent, it is about whether Keith has seen any evidence to prove one way or another. People shouldn't say it's poor taste to want evidence of a crime, it's the whole point of our judicial system.

This! For the win!

[rodimusprime]

Roethlisberger has been accused of rape 3 times.

It's odd b/c even the things Big Ben did at parties seems completely fucked up. Pulling his dick out and walking up to women was one of his "moves" at parties and shit. Forcing his hands up skirts and all kinds of other shit. Just creepy.
Then the deleting of files from phones of witnesses by his body guards and him saying the girl "fell and I helped her up"? It doesn't sound good.

Then reading the second accuser's account of the incident? Seemed very damning to me.

Dude was accused of rape at least twice that we know of and settled out of court once. Statistically less than 3% of rape accusations are false.

And I agree the information was much harder to find than the Ray Rice / Adrian Peterson stuff. I think Roethlisberger benefited from this happening just before the TMZ era of sports journalism started. He also benefited from the fact that our society doesn't talk openly about rape in detail b/c many feel it's not in good taste to go into detail like that in the national media.