2576: No Kidding

[PsychoLoco]

Originally Posted by Mermaid

Wow, being excluded from something must be new to you.

How nice.

I've been excluded from stuff all my life. My problem is the concept of a safe space. I moved out of the US in 1996. I live in Ukraine, a corrupt country where I can have my property seized at any time with no due process, or I can just be declared persona non grata and have to leave everything behind or get deported forcefully. Plus, there's a war going on a few hours East of my apartment that has killed 10,000 people and wounded 23,000 over the past 3 years. There are good and bad people here, and it's up to me to figure it out constantly. The concept of a safe space is literally foreign to me because it is a concept developed in the US over the past decade or so. All I'm saying is that all of my experience with KATG has been inclusive. Even if I was LGBT (or even a straight, white, cis male who had been the victim of rape) living in NYC, I would not have been invited because I don't know Chemda personally. But I'm sure Chemda has some male friends that support her and would have supported her event any way they could.

[Keith]

I wouldn't have, for the record, so it's okay.

[PsychoLoco]

Originally Posted by Keith

I wouldn't have, for the record, so it's okay.

I specifically left you out of this because you were very clear to Yamaneika that she wouldn't win any argument with Chemda on this.

[Keith]

Wasn't that. I just said my point and they can go at it.

You know, scratchin' like cats these broads.

[The Girl]

Originally Posted by PsychoLoco

I got lost in that huge thread. I meant what I said about trying not to be offended because I know you didn't mean it. I guess it's just one of those weird things about listening for almost a decade. I didn't mean that anyone should be allowed access to a safe space. I thought about how it could have been said in a way that wouldn't have offended me, and kind of decided it wasn't the purpose of the event, it was having to face the apparent fact that just walking into a room can trigger a horrible response in someone I've never met. Plenty of your guests have shows that are for a certain type of performer (all women, all minorities, all LGBT, etc.) and it never bothered me at all. If you had said, "We are doing this for these people to help them cope," I would simply have thought that it wasn't an event I'd be interested in attending. However, if you had added, "If you're not one of these people and want to participate, then please donate to KATG and help us buy food, drinks, candles to show your support," I think it would have been a lot less jarring for me to hear, but in the end it's something I needed to hear because I need to be part of the solution however I can.

There are people that I feel safe and wonderful with that I didn't invite. I don't expect them to contribute. We still love each other.

BUT since we're in the contributing spirit, I think this is a safe place to link the KATG marathon fundraiser that includes everyone.




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[Mermaid]

Originally Posted by PsychoLoco

I've been excluded from stuff all my life. My problem is the concept of a safe space. I moved out of the US in 1996. I live in Ukraine, a corrupt country where I can have my property seized at any time with no due process, or I can just be declared persona non grata and have to leave everything behind or get deported forcefully. Plus, there's a war going on a few hours East of my apartment that has killed 10,000 people and wounded 23,000 over the past 3 years. There are good and bad people here, and it's up to me to figure it out constantly. The concept of a safe space is literally foreign to me because it is a concept developed in the US over the past decade or so. All I'm saying is that all of my experience with KATG has been inclusive. Even if I was LGBT (or even a straight, white, cis male who had been the victim of rape) living in NYC, I would not have been invited because I don't know Chemda personally. But I'm sure Chemda has some male friends that support her and would have supported her event any way they could.

Safe spaces are far from new. Minority and LGBT safe spaces have existed for a very long time.

Only the terminology is new.

Sorry, I can't feel bad for you cause there was one thing in your 10 years of listening that wasn't catered to you.

As a white male visiting the United States (in this hypothetical situation) the literal world is your oyster. You could go literally anywhere you want for that night but you are upset about this one small house party.

[PsychoLoco]

Originally Posted by Mermaid

Safe spaces are far from new. Minority and LGBT safe spaces have existed for a very long time.

Only the terminology is new.

Sorry, I can't feel bad for you cause there was one thing in your 10 years of listening that wasn't catered to you.

As a white male visiting the United States (in this hypothetical situation) the literal world is your oyster. You could go literally anywhere you want for that night but you are upset about this one small house party.

I guess in the midst of my privilege I didn't notice the ladies meeting without me. Which brings me back to one of my original questions. Since I'm not a predator or stalking any of these women seeking safe spaces, should I continue to remain unaware or should I try to help? Common decency and a respect for human rights indicates the latter, but your attitude towards me indicates the former.

[Mermaid]

What you can do for "safe spaces":

Don't guilt trip women/minorities/LGBT/etc. for wanting to feel safe.
Don't guilt trip women/minorities/LGBT/etc. for wanting to be with themselves and only themselves.
Stop using #NotAllMen
Stop thinking it is a personal attack on your character.
Don't think people hate or dislike you because you are not invited.




It's annoying because it's selective offense. People get it when a guy says he wants a "man cave" or needs to just hang out with his boys. But people get forgetful and offended when women or brown people want to be left alone for a little bit.

[Enunciated Piffle]

You could light a candle. Smoke some weed. See if the answer doesn't come to you.

#solidarity #kumbaya

[Jo_Culprit]

Originally Posted by Mermaid

It's annoying because it's selective offense. People get it when a guy says he wants a "man cave" or needs to just hang out with his boys. But people get forgetful and offended when women or brown people want to be left alone for a little bit.

This is a very good point, and while apparently it's a myth that golf stands for "Gentlemen only Ladies Forbidden". When Golfing institutions take 80 years to admit female members it's less of a myth and more an implied meaning.
Augusta National admits women for first time in club's 80-year history
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...n-members-golf

Originally Posted by Mermaid

What you can do for "safe spaces":
Don't guilt trip women/minorities/LGBT/etc. for wanting to feel safe.
Don't guilt trip women/minorities/LGBT/etc. for wanting to be with themselves and only themselves.
Stop using #NotAllMen
Stop thinking it is a personal attack on your character.
Don't think people hate or dislike you because you are not invited.

The only instance I don't like safe spaces is where it shuts down discussion and dialogue on social issues:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8DZklYfbPc
It's key to note here though that the experience that Christine Sommers had with safe spaces is lumped in with all safe spaces and is used by right wing media to discredit safe spaces in general which leads to a perception problem with the general public.