935: Bad EYEdeas

[foxdougan]

Elon's story was, like, the greatest fucking story ever told. Except he laughed all the way through, which kinda ruined it - maybe Spooky should have told the story for him :P

[Los]

Originally Posted by spooky

I appreciate your response, don't take any of my assumptions personally.

Did you notice I was keeping in line with the guest of the show's tone? This Week In Blackness, Elon James is not White, etc. He pointed out racism by his mom, Jews, himself. If you're actually about to tell me that Black culture in broad strokes is not racist to any degree, I think you need to back away from the table, because you have no idea what you're talking about. Maybe you should consider getting to know some black folk, maybe get to know their ideas about what has happened to their culture, their ancestors and people they know. It's been a long time since slavery in terms of an individual life, but in terms of growing a culture from scratch, its been just a blink of an eye.

So we either get to agree on being able to discuss something in the same context or agree we do not communicate at all. If, as a white person, I am not able to communicate with someone because the very addressing of the subject by me constitutes offense, there is little point in communicating at all and we should just head on back to the days of separate but equal.

But I am glad you pointed out it is a numbers game, and only the majority loses rights. In a decade or so, I look forward to the return of racist humor from whites and lament that Latinos will no longer be allowed to make jokes because of their majority status. Hopefully by then, a certain minority culture in this country will have matured far enough that it won't play out like that.

Or race, if you want to actually make it about skin, though everyone pretty much recognizes it is culture we are discussing. Science doesn't really support the notion of actual separate races...

First, my point was that your statement that "Blacks in America are largely racist" is itself a racial generalization, and can be perceived as a racist comment. I did not say Blacks (or anyone else) are not racist to any degree. That would have been as much of a generalization as your statement, and would therefore be wrong. I just thought it was an interesting comment considering the topic of your post.

Second, I was not aware that your context was in regards to Elon James as representative of Black people. I don't know Elon, but I do know that he does not represent all Blacks because, believe it or not, not everyone's the same. To believe that one or even a hundred individuals represent an entire group is again, a generalization.

Third, you assume that I'm not Black and that I don't know Black culture. I am Black and I'm in the culture, but that wasn't even the point. Your generalization essentially negated the point you were making, but I'm not sure if you see that.

Fourth, when you're talking to Black people about Black people, there's no need to go all the way back to slavery to find racial injustice in America. Jim Crow laws, anti-miscegenation laws, etc. practically ended yesterday.

Fifth, I'm suprised you would support the idea that human racial classifications don't exist in biology (I agree). You're White and from the South, so you have to be a white supremacist, right? Or is that a generalization?

As a member of the majority, it's interesting that you say the "majority loses". What exactly have you personally lost?

If it's racist humor from Whites that you're waiting for, there's a show called Keith and The Girl that you might want to listen to.

Don't take any of my comments personally and we'll be good.

[B. Money]

Elon and Patrice have a really similar cadence

[Andrea's toothbrush]

Originally Posted by Besmee

I got up to the part where the kid stabbed the other kid.

No, that kid should NOT have gotten life. For his whole life he is going to be living in jail, learning things faaar worse.

Doesn't matter if he learns how to be a hardened criminal in jail, because he isn't getting out of jail.

[Andrea's toothbrush]

Originally Posted by foxdougan

Elon's story was, like, the greatest fucking story ever told. Except he laughed all the way through, which kinda ruined it - maybe Spooky should have told the story for him :P

I thought you wanted to make the story better? Get Jesse Joyce to tell it.

[spooky]

Originally Posted by Los

First, my point was that your statement that "Blacks in America are largely racist" is itself a racial generalization, and can be perceived as a racist comment. I did not say Blacks (or anyone else) are not racist to any degree. That would have been as much of a generalization as your statement, and would therefore be wrong. I just thought it was an interesting comment considering the topic of your post.

Youre right. I intentionally made a general statement, the emphasis was not on the individual in this sense. I realize that when a black comedian makes a racial stereotype about white people, it doesnt apply to every individual, but I usually laugh because I can plainly see the origin of that stereotype. There are enough examples to paint with a broad brush.

If we want to only speak on individuals, there really is no point to sociology.

I should have made myself clearer to begin with.

Originally Posted by Los

Second, I was not aware that your context was in regards to Elon James as representative of Black people. I don't know Elon, but I do know that he does not represent all Blacks because, believe it or not, not everyone's the same. To believe that one or even a hundred individuals represent an entire group is again, a generalization.

I should have said black culture, not blacks, youre right, a communication error on my part.

Originally Posted by Los

Third, you assume that I'm not Black and that I don't know Black culture. I am Black and I'm in the culture, but that wasn't even the point. Your generalization essentially negated the point you were making, but I'm not sure if you see that.

I assumed you were black. But you were makin' a huff about assumptions so I just spelled it out for you, to take a look around.

Originally Posted by Los

Fourth, when you're talking to Black people about Black people, there's no need to go all the way back to slavery to find racial injustice in America. Jim Crow laws, anti-miscegenation laws, etc. practically ended yesterday.

Wrong. Wrong wrong wrong.

Those laws are absolutely NOT why the culture is the way it is, the origin lies in slavery. Slavery broke apart the family unit, ended the passing down of learned behavior(culture) from one generation to the next. It is exactly like Cambodia now, you can't blame laws after Khamer Rouge for the country and the broken culture, you blame the KR for killing all the teachers, all the educated people, anyone wearing even glasses. Cambodia, like Black culture in America, had to start over again, from scratch.

If you suddenly changed laws and made everything anti white, you wouldnt suddenly come up with broken culture. Look at the Jews. No shortage of hate/oppression there, but they didn't suffer in the same way culturally.

Slavery broke the culture, if you don't directly refer to it as the problem, you're not addressing the problem at all.

Originally Posted by Los

Fifth, I'm suprised you would support the idea that human racial classifications don't exist in biology (I agree). You're White and from the South, so you have to be a white supremacist, right? Or is that a generalization?

It is a generalization that, painted with a broad brush, holds true, yes. Most people, white or black(and when you say the "South", thats where the majority of Black america is), you are right, they believe in racial classification. Most people do not closely follow science.

I think, if you visit the south, you will be hard pressed to find any large number of white supremecists. I'd guess its a number far below 0.01%. I would argue that part, but speaking in general terms, not the other.

Originally Posted by Los

As a member of the majority, it's interesting that you say the "majority loses". What exactly have you personally lost?

If it's racist humor from Whites that you're waiting for, there's a show called Keith and The Girl that you might want to listen to.

Don't take any of my comments personally and we'll be good.

I couldn't care less about what oppertunities I may have lost beyond the entertainment field. I'm sure a Black in America has personally lost more, though, obviously, thats a racist statement. But not all racist statements are detrimental, some are, possibly, justified.

And that was my point, it is okay for Blacks in America to be racist, it is, at least at this point in it's cultural growth, justified. When a white fella gets assaulted for wandering into a black neighborhood, it isn't prosecuted under "hate crime" laws(though arguably it is prosecuted more vigorously, if we are painting with broad brushstrokes).

So, if enslavement is the standard for allowing racism, is it alright for Spaniards to make racist comments? Or is it a double standard? Or, if it is just about number of babies, as you argue, riddle me this: Is it morally wrong(this will make your head explode) for Africans formerly under British rule to be cuturally predisposed to mistrust of the white man? Should they be prosecuted under hate crime if they harm a white(since they are locally a majority), but the former Imperialist whites, being the minority, if they assaulted a black, they should be allowed more lieniency, after all, they are white?

[littlp]

Just wanted to say, loved Elon as a guest, hope he comes back on again. Thought his story was funny (even though I really shouldn't have laughed).

[Los]

Originally Posted by spooky

Youre right. I intentionally made a general statement, the emphasis was not on the individual in this sense. I realize that when a black comedian makes a racial stereotype about white people, it doesnt apply to every individual, but I usually laugh because I can plainly see the origin of that stereotype. There are enough examples to paint with a broad brush.

I know that you understand the point I was making about your generalization. That's really the only reason I replied to your first post.

Originally Posted by spooky

...the origin lies in slavery. Slavery broke apart the family unit, ended the passing down of learned behavior(culture) from one generation to the next. It is exactly like Cambodia now, you can't blame laws after Khamer Rouge for the country and the broken culture, you blame the KR for killing all the teachers, all the educated people, anyone wearing even glasses. Cambodia, like Black culture in America, had to start over again, from scratch.

Your broader argument that slavery and the breakdown of the family unit among Black Americans has directly affected the culture is right. But (trust me on this), racial injustices experienced within modern times are more relevant to the individual than events that are hundreds of years past. That doesn't mean slavery is not important, but being a second-class citizen until fairly recently in American history is just as significant. That was my point.

Originally Posted by spooky

I think, if you visit the south, you will be hard pressed to find any large number of white supremecists. I'd guess its a number far below 0.01%. I would argue that part, but speaking in general terms, not the other.

My comment about the South was just a joke, but whether you've personally observed it or not, de facto segregation is alive and well in much of the South (and everwhere else). Latent ideals of racial superiority aren't dead yet.

Originally Posted by spooky

When a white fella gets assaulted for wandering into a black neighborhood, it isn't prosecuted under "hate crime" laws(though arguably it is prosecuted more vigorously, if we are painting with broad brushstrokes).

In regards to hate crimes, I see where you're coming from. In this country, I think the point was that enough racially motivated crimes were going unpunished by law enforcement to warrant the establishment of new laws. It's probably similar to the creation of civil rights laws when laws protecting the rights of citizens already existed. I haven't studied hate crime law enough to argue for or against.

I'm pretty sure that if an epidemic of crimes against Whites were committed that were racially motivated, there would be no shortage of prosecutions, with or without hate crime law. The public would (and should) demand it from their elected officials.

Originally Posted by spooky

Is it morally wrong(this will make your head explode) for Africans formerly under British rule to be cuturally predisposed to mistrust of the white man? Should they be prosecuted under hate crime if they harm a white(since they are locally a majority), but the former Imperialist whites, being the minority, if they assaulted a black, they should be allowed more lieniency, after all, they are white?

Your comment about Africans under British rule does not specifically apply to the US. In that example, the smaller group (smaller in number of individuals) was in control over the larger group. This is unusual for the US, but as I said, the election of President Obama changed everything. Smaller groups of young and first-time voters, and individual racial and religious minority groups became politically active and exerted some control, even though most members of the majority voted for McCain. But I do see your point.

[Elon James White]

Originally Posted by Los

I don't know Elon, but I do know that he does not represent all Blacks...

Actually. There was an election. I was voted spokersperson. Thats how I got the whole "This Week in Blackness" gig. There was a memo.

___________
ejw
Yes, I'm black.
TWiB! | This Week In Blackness | A BcCo Publication

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Elon James White

Actually. There was an election. I was voted spokersperson. Thats how I got the whole "This Week in Blackness" gig. There was a memo.

___________
ejw
Yes, I'm black.
TWiB! | This Week In Blackness | A BcCo Publication

First of all, Fuck you and welcome to the forums.

Second, hilarity obviously ensued, GOY.