Israeli Palestinian Conflict Thread

[Sgt Rosie]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

Alright.

I'm not really one for summaries, though. I mean, I think the creation of Israel was wrong, and the wrong should be righted. At the very least, the US should stop supporting Israel (and I'm not talking about just our leaders).

Damn straight. Nothing would cheer the Middle East up more than a good soap hockey field.

Ok - so essentially disolve Israel and put it back the way it was in the early 1940's?

[Cretaceous Bob]

Originally Posted by Sgt Rosie

Ok - so essentially disolve Israel and put it back the way it was in the early 1940's?

Yes. Except without the Zionists being troublemakers. And the British bit.

[Alexandra]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

I'm guessing, like in most cases, misinformation is caused by a combination of a vehement proponent minority and ignorance.

So I don't care. I can't and won't silence the proponents, and the dissemination of fact is an antidote to ignorance.

And by "dissemination of fact", is this what you had in mind?
LiveLeak.com - Egyptian Cleric Justifies The Holocaust,Airs Footage And "Hopes It Will Happen Again But,Allah Willing,At The Hand Of Muslims".

[Cretaceous Bob]

Originally Posted by Alexandra

And by "dissemination of fact", is this what you had in mind?
LiveLeak.com - Egyptian Cleric Justifies The Holocaust,Airs Footage And "Hopes It Will Happen Again But,Allah Willing,At The Hand Of Muslims".

If you're going to put "dissemination of fact" in quotes and then cite something totally stupid, you might as well have quoted yourself.

If truth and fact cannot combat agenda-driven misinformation, I'd like to thank you for permanently damaging the world, Alexandra.

I've already said everything that answers your question, so I don't know why you're trying to apply it anyway.

[Sgt Rosie]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

Yes. Except without the Zionists being troublemakers. And the British bit.

So a multi-cultural state with the non-Zionist Jews being allowed to stay? OK, without the British around how do you see the governance being set up?

[Cretaceous Bob]

Originally Posted by Sgt Rosie

So a multi-cultural state with the non-Zionist Jews being allowed to stay?

Yeah.

Originally Posted by Sgt Rosie

OK, without the British around how do you see the governance being set up?

The process of dissolution should be overseen by a UN coalition, but after there is a relative state of calm simply hand the reigns to the residents.

[Alexandra]

Originally Posted by Cretaceous Bob

If you're going to put "dissemination of fact" in quotes and then cite something totally stupid, you might as well have quoted yourself.

If truth and fact cannot combat agenda-driven misinformation, I'd like to thank you for permanently damaging the world, Alexandra.

I've already said everything that answers your question, so I don't know why you're trying to apply it anyway.

I can't tell from your overuse of pronouns and hyperbole what you are trying to say here.

Here, in crayon for you, is my point: you state that your goal is to "disseminate facts" to combat "misinformation". You share that goal with the lovely Egyptian cleric. Do you, or do you not agree with his version of "fact"? If not, can you or can you not see the problem with all of these different versions of "fact" being presented as "fact" to combat "misinformation"?

[Cretaceous Bob]

Originally Posted by Alexandra

I can't tell from your overuse of pronouns and hyperbole what you are trying to say here.

Here, in crayon for you, is my point: you state that your goal is to "disseminate facts" to combat "misinformation". You share that goal with the lovely Egyptian cleric. Do you, or do you not agree with his version of "fact"? If not, can you or can you not see the problem with all of these different versions of "fact" being presented as "fact" to combat "misinformation"?

Yes, me preventing you from contradicting a well-documented fact is the same as heavily opinionated supposition.

Are you now going to try to say that me saying Britain did not create Israel is not a fact, and I am putting a biased spin on things?

I mean, seriously? This isn't the same. I'm talking about reasonable person talking to reasonable person preventing the spread of factual inaccuracies, and you're off talking about crazy person defeating crazy person with opposing spin doctoring.

So everything he said that was factually untrue will not, I believe, hold water against the facts. Like the stuff about the Jewish effect on Germany. That is factually untrue. He does state some facts, such as that the Germans blamed the Jews and exterminated them in hopes of making their country better and the worldwide opinion of Jews at the time. But the conclusions and opinions his posits based on these facts are not at all what I was addressing in my statement. It is inaccuracy vs. accuracy, not opinion vs. opinion. That's a different matter.

Now if you're going to try to say there are no facts, just opinions, whatever. I'm not going to have that conversation, just so that you can scramble out of basing your opinions off of lies.

[motownguy]

I'll say that even if it is just the "observer effect" of media, there are certainly many presentations of "fact" out there. Having not been in the area in question recently, I tend to believe firsthand accounts of people who have been there. Even the "most trusted name in news" doesn't exactly have an unsullied reputation.

e.g.

Ed Driscoll.com: New <I>Silicon Graffiti</i> Video: "Picture Kill"

[Cretaceous Bob]

Originally Posted by motownguy

I'll say that even if it is just the "observer effect" of media, there are certainly many presentations of "fact" out there. Having not been in the area in question recently, I tend to believe firsthand accounts of people who have been there. Even the "most trusted name in news" doesn't exactly have an unsullied reputation.

e.g.

Ed Driscoll.com: New <I>Silicon Graffiti</i> Video: "Picture Kill"

I'd say one of the worst places to get news is through American news television. It's pretty horrific the lack of attention they pay to what they report, and the amount of uninformed dummies make appearances.

I agree there is a hierarchy of what to trust.